Francis Herbert Sims--did he go to Australia?

[rhsd22]

Hopefully, I'm asking this in the right forum. (I'm new on here).

For many years we've had a family rumour about an uncle that joined the navy and was lost aboard a ship that was sunk during WW1 and, until now, no other details except a photograph of a man in uniform. The rumour goes that, at a later point, a letter was received from abroad from said uncle to one of his sisters. The suggestion in the family is that he did a runner somewhere in Africa. However, my current research has confirmed some and debunked other parts of that but turned up a tantalising link to Australia which is my stumbling block.

The person in question is Francis Herbert Sims, b. 11.06.1891 (according to his RN service record) but 1893 according to 1901 census.

From his service record, he joined the RN on 07/06/1910 and served on a variety of ships as a stoker, rising from 2nd class to leading stoker. The photograph shows a stokers badge and what could be Leviathon on the cap band. He served on HMS Leviathon from 21/10/1911 to 12/02/1913. He also served on HMS Pegasus from 11/03/1913 to 30/09/1914. HMS Pegasus was sunk in Zanzibar Harbour on 20/09/1914, so this partially ties in with the family rumour. However, he continued to serve throughout the war but his service was terminated after a civil conviction on 05/09/1919. Perhaps this was why the rumour started that he was "lost" somehow.

I've tried some searches using his name and the names of the ships he served in and, surprisingly, I hit this link. https://search.ancestry.com.au/cgi-bi...0&msbdp=1&cp=0

Basically, the link is an old photograph of a ship HMS Rosemary and "attached to" Francis Herbert Sims (1892-1920). His service record indicates a posting to HMS Island Prince (Rosemary) from 26/01/1916 to 31/03/1916. Island Prince seems to be a shore establishment on the NE coast of England from which Rosemary probably operated.

The problem is, how do I investigate this further? The link suggests that someone is possibly researching from the other direction.

F.H.Sims is my Gt.Grandfather's brother and one of 8 siblings.

Any help would be much appreciated. Thanks.

[Peter Goodey]

the link is an old photograph of a ship HMS Rosemary and "attached to" Francis Herbert Sims (1892-1920).

Why do you think he went to Australia? The tree you're referring to shows that Francis Herbert Sims died in Hartlepool (or at least it was registered there) in 1920. Is this your man or isn't it?

BTW that photo is also accessible through the .uk site.

[Peter Goodey]

Also, ADM171 (RN Medal Roll) shows for Francis H Sims in column 5 "F" (Forfeited) and in Column 6 "R" (Run)

[rhsd22]

Thank you Peter, I am very new to this, so lots yet to learn about where to look for information. I guess the question of Australia came from the link appearing to be on the Australian Ancestry website. No idea why it would link that way if the same info was available under the UK site as well.

However, I've looked up the UK one and, yes it does appear to be my man. Sadly, it seems to bear out the family tale that he did a runner, though not in Africa it would seem. He has "Run Vivid II 5.9.19 See Cas 20103/2? for correspondence re (looks like) desertions A6?? 13/3/20" recorded on his service record.

At least we've finally found out what happened to him...he has been an enigma for many years.

Many thanks.

[shippo]

The tree you're referring to shows that Francis Herbert Sims died in Hartlepool (or at least it was registered there) in 1920.

Death index
March quarter 1920
SIMS Francis B aged 27 Hartlepool 10a 155

The above fella was Francis B and not Francis H... A death cert. should help to confirm if his your fella or not.

[shippo]

The suggestion in the family is that he did a runner somewhere in Africa. However, my current research has confirmed some and debunked other parts of that but turned up a tantalising link to Australia which is my stumbling block.

A lot of times if they did a "runner" they would change their names as to not get caught. My 2x great uncle did a runner from the Boer War. No record under his birth name can be found after he disappeared tho family story is he changed his name.

[ChristineR]

The man in the tree linked to the ship photo was born 1892 Westbury, Wiltshire. A 1916 marriage in Durham to Phoebe Burton is quoted, naming his father as William Sims, labourer. It appears that he might have given his occupation as Foreman on the HMS Rosemary.

I checked the GRO image associated with the 1920 Hartlepool death -- it is Francis H Sims.
A burial index on Ancestry names him as Francis Herbert Sims gives his age as 29, and buried 24 Feb 1920 at Holy Trinity, Seaton Carew, England. Seaton Carew is within the Borough of Hartlepool.

The tree owner looks to be related to the BURTON side. Just PM me a message if you would like to me to pass it on.
Phoebe married again and emigrated to USA, dying 1935.

[rhsd22]

Thanks everyone for all your replies. Francis Herbert is certainly proving to be a challenge. Everything you've posted points to the correct individual so I thought I'd come to the conclusive end of the trail. It seems not, or at least not yet.

To follow up the civil conviction angle, I have unearthed a newspaper article about the conviction for theft (of a bicycle and raincoat)and the sentence to 2 months hard labour (both facts stated with case numbers on his service record) for "Said to be a deserter from the navy, a man named Francis Herbert Sims, who has been living at 36, Bowling-street, Mansfield". However, this article appeared in The Nottingham Evening Post edition dated Wednesday 14th April 1920. The offence is reported to have taken place on 6th April.

Looks like I'm going to be taking a couple field trips.