John Henry Charles Gardiner 1854

[Belinda1969]

Hi everyone,

Ive just started to do my grandmother's side of the family and already hit a brick wall

My Grandmother was Florence Annetta Gardiner..Born 18th Feb 1900..Her father n mother on the birth cert were John Henry Charles Gardiner & Phoebe Annie Gardiner nee Marshall..His occupation at the time was Glass Packer and was living at Marshall Road,Walworth..

Im looking for information on John & Phoebe
All i have on them is.....John born 1854 Lambeth and in 1901 was with Phoebe and Florence at Newington
Phoebe born 1863 Chelsea

I cannot find there Marriage or them in any other census,so any information on John & Phoebe would be much appreciated

Thankyou
Belinda

[olliecat]

My Grandmother was Florence Annetta Gardiner..Born 18th Feb 1900..Her father n mother on the birth cert were John Henry Charles Gardiner & Phoebe Annie Gardiner nee Marshall..His occupation at the time was Glass Packer and was living at Marshall Road,Walworth..

Cannot find them in 1911 for the moment. This could be a sibling for Florence - christening of Catherine Mary Gardiner on 08 Nov 1902 at Kennington St John the Divine. Father is John Henry Charles Gardiner and mother is Phoebe Annie. John's occupation is Packer.

[olliecat]

Her father n mother on the birth cert were John Henry Charles Gardiner & Phoebe Annie Gardiner nee Marshall..
All i have on them is.....John born 1854 Lambeth and in 1901 was with Phoebe and Florence at Newington
Phoebe born 1863 Chelsea

There is a christening for a Phabe (sic) Annie Marshall on 7 Jun 1863 at Chelsea St Luke. Parents are William and Annette.

I think I see her in the census with her mum (father died.) Still checking it.

[Belinda1969]

Hi

Yes Florence did have a sister Kathleen Mary Gardiner Born around 1901/1902..died 18th June 1967 buried at Royston...They just seem really hard family to find......Thanks for looking

[olliecat]

Belinda, do you wish me to post the census information I have found on Phoebe Annie Marshall?

[Belinda1969]

Yes please Olliecat....Thanks Belinda

[olliecat]

This is Phoebe Anne Gardiner in 1901 (which you already have.) I thought I'd post it so others could see.

1901: RG13 Piece: 382 Folio: 172 Page: 46 (crown copyright, care of the TNA)
36 Marsland Road, Newington
GARDINER, John, head, 47, packer warehouse, Lambeth London
GARDINER, Phoebe A, wife, 38, shirt machinist, Chelsea London
GARDINER, Florence A, dau, single, 14 mos, Walworth London

If Phoebe's maiden name was Marshall and she was born abt 1863 in Chelsea, then she is possibly the daughter of William Marshall and Annetta Georgina Keene. As far as I can make out, Annetta Georgina KEENE married William MARSHALL in 1862 in Chelsea. William Marshall's occupation on his marriage cert is Surveyor. He must have died before the 1871 census (I haven't looked for a record yet.)

Annetta is here in 1871, but I'm not sure where little Phoebe is for the moment.

1871: RG10 Piece: 110 Folio: 64 Page: 26 (crown copyright, care of the TNA)
Sutherland St, St George Hanover Sq, Westminster
MARSHALL, Anetta, mother, widow, 28, dressmaker, Brompton
KEENE, George H, brother, 24, hotel manager, Lambeth Surrey

Note: the census is a bit odd in the Anetta is recorded as mother (mother of whom, there is no child listed?)

1881: RG11 Piece: 536 Folio: 10 Page: 13 (crown copyright, care of the TNA)
29 Rodney Pl East, Newington
MARSHALL, Annie, head, widow, 35, widow of an architect, Brompton Middlesex
MARSHALL, Phoebe, dau, 18, machine saleswoman, Chelsea Middlesex

1891: RG12 Piece: 365 Folio: 42 Page: 25 (crown copyright, care of the TNA)
56 Sturgeon Road, Newington, Southwark
MARSHALL, Phoebe A, head, 25, ladies maid, Chelsea London
MARSHALL, Georgina A, mother, wid, 44, mantle maker, Brompton London
GRAHAM, Annie, nursechild, 5, Westminster London

Phoebe's mum in 1901...

1901: RG13 Piece: 420 Folio: 55 Page: 39 (crown copyright, care of the TNA)
83 St Agnes Place, Lambeth
MARSHALL, Anetta head, widow, 54, mantle maker, Brompton Kent
MARSHALL, Annie, wife?, single, 14, no occupation, Westminster London
BROOKE, Mary, niece, single, 40, incandescent mantle wks, City London

It all needs further checking I think.

[Belinda1969]

Thankyou so very much Olliecat

[Jellylegs]

Have also been looking at this and came up with the same as Olliecat.

I wonder if this is Phoebe Annie in 1871 with her Grandparents? (RG10/1122/86/24) - (record held by TNA, Crown Copyright)

James MARSHALL (head) 72 - Cordwainer employing 3 men, born Petersfield, Hants
Mary Ann MARSHALL (wife) 70 born Portsea, Hants
Phoebe A MARSHALL (grand daughter) 8 born Chelsea, Middlesex
William G MARSHALL (grand son) 12 born Chelsea, Middlesex

There is a marriage on Ancestry's London, England Marriages and Banns 1754 - 1921 of William MARSHALL and Annetta Georgina KEENE on 15.06.1862 at St. Luke, Chelsea. William was 37 and a widower. His occupation was a surveyor. Annette Georgina is listed as a 20 year old spinster. Parents listed as James MARSHALL a bootmaker and George KEENE a commercial traveller. The witnesses were Thomas and Phoebe DEANE.

Annetta Georgiana KEENE baptised 17.09.1843 St. Mary, Lambeth - parents George KEENE and Anetta (something I can't read). George is an Accountant.

[olliecat]

Annetta Georgiana KEENE baptised 17.09.1843 St. Mary, Lambeth - parents George KEENE and Anetta (something I can't read).

Good findings Jellylegs.

I believe it says Annetta Cage on the christening record. Which ties in with a marrige held on 25 Oct 1841 at St John the Evangelist, Lambeth between George Keene and Annetta Cage Sawyer. His father Samuel Keene, a merchant. Her father John Sawyer, a gentleman.

Back to the future:-
Belinda, do you have any more information on John and Phoebe Annie Gardener such as when/where they died. It's bugging me that I can't find either of them in the 1911 census or their two daughters. Also, when and where did the daughters marry, (I don't know if you want to say)?