Wife turnover rates in 18th century

[esdel]

Your opinions please:
How big a gap between children is reasonable?
Does a sudden change to 'one child per year' indicate a new wife?

For example I have (all in Kirkburton, Yorks):
Jonathan Mosley, father of
..... Susannah chr 1738 married Benjamin Senior 1761
..... Charles chr 1740
. ....Betty chr 1742 married John Blacker 1763
..... Sally chr 1745
..... Richard chr 1747 married Susanna Stevenson 1777
. ........ George chr 1778
. ........ George chr 1781
. ........ James chr 1791
. ........ Susannah chr 1797
..... George chr 1750

Then a Jonathan Mosley married Hannah Jenkinson 1757

and a Jonathan Mosley had these children:
. .... Hannah chr 1765
. .... Sally chr 1767
. .... George chr 1770
. .... James chr 1772

So how many Jonathan is that likely to be?
Many thanks

esdel

[Pam Downes]

Well, do you want the good news, or the bad?
It could be one, or it could be ten. (One child each. ) My estimate - two.
If you've got that information from the IGI, most of it is submitted. Because most of those entries have a date, then the chances are that a record exists in the PRs. (If it said 'about' then the entry could just be guesswork.)
What you haveto do, is to go through the PRs and extract all the baptisms marriages and burials for all of the Mosleys for most of the century. (I say 'you', because I seriously cannot see anyone giving what will probably amount to quite a bit more than several hours of their time to such a project.)
I believe you said that you didn't have an LDS FHC locally, in which case your only option seems to be a visit to the Yorkshire office(s) which hold the PRs.
Without all those baptisms, marriages, and burials from the PRs (and you should also refer to the BTs and ATs for complete accuracy in your research), no-one can say for certain just how many Jonathans are involved in those births.
Pam

[esdel]

Thanks Pam
I'd be very interested in your two - which two?
The data is all from IGI (their new Records Index thingy) - which is GREAT - but whether submitted or "from records" (and whose) I am not sure. Many have a day and month given - which I did not bother you with as I just wanted the opinion that you kindly provided.

The opinion you gave is exactly what help I need because I am looking for a 'rule of thumb' as to how big the gaps in families can be and the stop/start intermittency of successive children and their numbers from one man or woman.

Many wives died in 'child bed fever' etc in those days but I do not know the statistical frequency nor how reliable such a number would be. Probably almost meaningless?

esdel

[Pam Downes]

I'd be very interested in your two - which two?

I've not investigated - nor am I going to - that far. As I've already said, without knowing all the entries in the PRs anything would be guesswork.
You asked 'how many Jonathans?', and based purely on the gap of fifteen years I said two. Could still be one. Because

I am looking for a 'rule of thumb' as to how big the gaps in families can be

is like the length of the proverbial piece of string. There is no 'rule of thumb', otherwise every couple would be like my 2x great grandparents and not have any children until they'd been married eleven years. Or like my cousin who decided to have four children in 5 years.
If a wife dies, some husbands marry within a year, some wait several years. Depends how old any children from the first marriage are. Depends if there's anyone he wants to marry - and also if anyone wants to marry him. (Ditto, in the case of husbands dying.)
The only real rule is based on the lines of 'if William and Mary had a child in 1817' and William and Mary had a child in 1857 it is extremely unlikely that it is the same Mary'. That rule only works when the wife's name is the same in both cases . Though it's probably a different William too in 1857 - something you hopefully confirm as you trawl through the PRs.
Pam

[Geoffers]

Your opinions please:
How big a gap between children is reasonable?

At least nine months if the same mother is involved.

As to a maximum length of time between children? - impossible to say.

You mentioned having the information from the flawed IGI. To draw a conclusion, you would need to use the real sources mentionedby Pam

Does a sudden change to 'one child per year' indicate a new wife?

No.

[Vance Mead]

There are some averages involved. Having read some books on English demographic history (Wrigley and Schofield), I can say that the average gap between children was two years and a few months, perhaps falling to three-year intervals when the women was in her 30s. The gap was longer among working people, who breast-fed their children. Gentry women used wet-nurses, so they got pregnant again sooner. They often had children at one-year intervals.

As for the numbers of marriages. I'm sure everyone here has examples of men who married several times, even late in life. My experience is that if the couple had young children and the wife died, the man remarried soon afterwards, often within a year. Of course anything is possible, but I would be agree with the posters above, that a marriage 10 or 15 years later would probably be another person.

[Sue Mackay]

And sometimes there's a gap because the husband was in the army... or in prison

[DBCoup]

At least nine months if the same mother is involved.

As to a maximum length of time between children? - impossible to say.

And, sadly, some "extended" gaps could include miscarriages which presumably would not yield anything to baptise (or at least record) depending, I guess, on at what stage of the pregnancy the miscarriage occurred.
Or the husband could be away somewhere for work (for which the almost permanently pregnant wife was probably grateful).

I can only reiterate the advice given - there is no substitute for going through the Parish Records yourself - that way you will know how accurate the records are. Plus there may be other information recorded.

[SBSFamilyhistory]

Hi, there was a large gap in between births in my grandparents children.

My father's sister Frances, now deased was born in 1911, my father Joseph, also deseased was not born until 1928. Yes there were two other children born inbetween, Henry 1914 and Leslie 1916.

I think that given my grandparents had to get married, as Frances was born some 16 weeks after their marriage, and my father was born when Gran was 40 perhaps neither of these children were not planned.

oh yes the same parents

Sue

[Dargie]

My mother was born eighteen years, yes 18 years ,after her sister.
My grandmother did not have miscarriages, my grandfather was not in the army, away at work, in prison, supporting a mistress or in the lunatic asylum. They were completely devoted to each other.
It just happened that way.
And I say good for them. (As otherwise I would not be here to write this bombastic note)

Actually If this thread is called "Wife turnover rates" I would like to point out that a lot of women on my tree had several "Husband turnover rates" as well!

And by the way every single entry I have ever found on IGI was flawed. I choose not to use it.
After trusting one entry which appeared to have all the correct qualifications, one branch of my tree needed a thorough and complete pruning job. I am now in the process of waiting for the postman each morning in order to obtain the appropriate Parish registers in an honest attempt to get it all right!

There is simply no short cut..... it has to be done.

Marj