Maria Butler & Thomas Brain.

[birdlip]

1841 in Wootton, Oxfordshire;

H0107/ 890/ 20/ 12/ 22/ P3

Mathias BUTLER 45 Ag lab y
Charlotte do 40 y
Mathias do Ag lab y
Mary do 15 y
Luke do 9 y
Gabriel do 4 y
Ann do 2 y

[MarkJ]

Seems like a good result there Ben - clever bit of detective work!

Mark

[benny1982]

Hi Birdlip

Wow. Thanks for the census info.

Ben

[birdlip]

You're welcome, that was the easy bit!

It seems odd though doesn't it, that they have a Mary 15, as well as having had a Maria? Its annoying that the 41 census doesn't give relationships though, and we shouldn't just assume they are all Mat(t)hias and Charlotte's children.

The marriage info on IGI is a bit confusing...

Matthias BUTLER m Charlotte RUSSELL 21 Oct 1813 Wootton, Oxfordshire.

This is a submitted entry though, then there is ANOTHER submittted entry here, where the year has been changed;

Matthias BUTLER m Charlotte RUSSELL 21 Oct 1831 Wootton, Oxfordshire.

Then, to confuse matters further, there is this, still on IGI, from the Oxford Marriage Transcripts;

Matthias BUTLER m Mary Hull 1816 Wootton, Oxfordshire [Batch 7250002]

[benny1982]

Hi birdlip

Well Mary and Maria do sound the same but I have had cases where there are 2 sisters with those names though.

Maybe Matthias married Mary, she died then he married Charlotte.

Ben

[birdlip]

You'll need to take a look at the Woottton marriage registers, or ask SKS to do a look up for you. Obviously the 1813 and the 1831 marriage can't BOTH be right, so it looks like either;

1] The 1813 marriage is the right one, and the 1816 marriage is another Matthias, perhaps his father, remarrying in middle age. Or;

2] The 1831 marriage is the right one, and Charlotte is Matthias's second wife. His first wife Mary, who he married in 1816, would then turn out to be Maria's mother, not Charlotte.

[birdlip]

Maybe Matthias married Mary, she died then he married Charlotte.

Snap!

[benny1982]

I do have the Oxon Marriage Index on CD so will look at the transcript 1831 one and see if it says Matthias is a widow.

[benny1982]

UPDATE

In 1831 Matthias was a widower. So Mary Hull is Maria's birth mother. I also found a Thomas Hull born about 1790 in Wootton born orth. Possible brother of Mary and birthplace for Mary.

Matthias Butler is on the 1851 census aged 62 born Chesterton, living in Wootton. There is a death of a Mathias Butler in 1858 in the right district.

I now need to access Wootton, Oxfordshire PRs. What a coincidence as there is also a Wootton in Berks south of Oxfordshire and I have ancestors from there as well.

A huge roaring success and that fact that Matthias lived past the 1851 census so a birthplace could be given.

Ben

[birdlip]

Good morning Ben, and well done!! Very obliging of Matthias to hang around until the 51 census, wasn't it?