Harry Vernon St Patrick Chaplin

[spison]

Not brilliant news. There is copyright on that info. You probably have everything available from Adele's post as your man was an unassisted immigrant. You could look at the following address and search using the name of the ship. The Marathon was a steamer and made many trips to Sydney. There were other ships with the name Marathon.
https://www.records.nsw.gov.au/
Jane

[where's harry?]

Thank you for the Aussie info. I know for sure that Ivo did not go to Australia. Apart from a spell in the Air Force travelling around a bit, he stayed in England all his life and died in Southampton. I am pretty certain that the Henry/Harry you found, Hugh, is not mine, mine was son of a Henry (John) Playfair Chaplin. Harry had a brother Pierre Playfair Chaplin who went to Australia and also had brothers in South Africa, but there's no sign of my Harry having travelled to either place even though he didn't seem to have died in the UK. I have been through every single Ancestry record 3 times and can find no record of a death.
Re Ivo's birth registrations, the 1904 Chaplin one is a copy of his official Chaplin one that was done in 1922, his original 1904 birth was registered under the name of Hatton with no father mentioned. Does anyone know if Harry would have had to have been present in 1922 in order for Ivo to be formally registered as Chaplin, or if mother Olive could have done that on her own? I suspect that Harry was not Ivo's father (although the use of the name Vernon strongly suggests that he was) and that Ivo found out in 1922 when he went into the Air Force - hence no further contact with his parents.

[spison]

Further to that and only you will know,
How clear was the writing for Vernon? I have a Ivan Norman Chaplin marrying in Canterbury (Sydney) to Dulcie Moloney in 1942 (ref. 2280/1942). No death recorded for that but he may still be alive in 1978. It's certainly interesting and perhaps worth looking at.
Jane

[where's harry?]

Hi Jane
Many thanks for helping out, I really appreciate it. Ivo was defiantely Ivo Vernon Chaplin and did not travel to Australia - at least certainly not when he was an adult. In 1942 he was laying runways in Mesopotamia and he spent some time in North Africa.
What I don't understand is how both he and Harry can be missing from the 1911 census. Harry may well have gone walkabout, but Ivo was only 7 at the time and the only place he mentioned regarding his childhood was Hastings.

[spison]

Good luck,
Anything else you need just yell. Our timing was impecable on our last post - simultaneous!

[AdeleE]

On his marriage certificate, what was Harry's occupation?

Adele

[where's harry?]

Hi Adele
Here's what I have on Harry:
1901 - Barman, Wood Green, Middlesex
1905 - Harry was a licensed victualler on the 1905 marriage certificate, living with Olive in Euston Road, London (Olive was living in Agnes Street in 1904 when Ivo was born). Witnesses did not come from either Harry or Olive's families - something else to unravel, but for now I am concentrating on where Ivo and Harry were in 1911.
1922 - Ivo's Chaplin birth registry. Harry was a victualler living at Prospect Place, Hastings. Olive and Ivo were registered there in 1921 - but again no Harry.
I don't have Ivo's marriage certificate to see what he says about Harry - didn't seem to be much point as all contact was cut in 1922 and Ivo wouldn't have known what Harry was up to.
On the 1904 Hatton birth a bit has been added on the right which says 'Parents now married. Birth re-registered based on their joint information on the authority of the Registrar General on the 16th August 1922'. Looks like Harry was alive in 1922, but where was he??? I checked all of the Ancestry UK marriages as well as the deaths for Harry - nothing for Harry there either.

[SueP]

Hi

I have had a go at looking for your men!

I've searched FmyP for a death of Harry V St P Chaplin 1922-1946

The closest find as regards age was:
Death: Harry Chaplin (73), Sep 1950, Southend, 4a, 595.

There was another but age is a few years out. The location was the key to noting it:
Death: Harry Chaplin (63), Sep 1954, Colchester, 4a, 389.

My 'favourite' is the first, but no guarantee!

Then as regards Ivo: had a search on 1911 census and closest I got was finding a Vernon Chaplin, aged 8, scholar, but born East Stoneham (I don't know where this is?). He is listed as son of Samuel (aged 53) and Mary Ann Chaplin (aged 48), living at East Stoneham.

Could Ivo have been 'farmed' out to relatives due to his parents not 'living together'? (And they treated him as a son). I saved the image to my computer, so if you want to see it private email me with your email address.

I also checked the GRO births for another Vernon, 1903-1906, but couldn't find one, not even with Vernon as a second/third name. (Your chap Ivo was the only one I came across).

And then on the issue of his re-registration there was an act brought in, but not until 1926, that legitimised children of parents that subsequently married after the birth. The father had to be present and a declaration filled in I believe. And I wouldn't have thought that Harry would say he was his child if he wasn't?

Sorry I couldn't help you more.

Regards
Sue

[where's harry?]

Hi Sue
I have the Vernon Chaplin and Samuel image, thanks. I'm not sure what to make of it as there is no Vernon birth, although the other 3 sons are registered in Bosmere. The only birth that fits Vernon is for an Albert Edward R Chaplin in Bosmere. Maybe Vernon was his nickname? The age is a bit out too (not unusual I suppose) as my Ivo would have just turned 7 at census time in 1911 and he should have either been with his parents or have been sent away to school in Hastings. Also, there are no Samuels in my lot that I am aware of. It is interesting though as Harry was registered as Vernon in 1891 when he was bumped off to an orphanage. No idea why they sent him away, his mother was still alive and his other siblings were with her in 1891.
Not sure about the Harry death either, there is a Harry Chaplin born in London in the last quarter of 1877 - he would have been the right age to have died in Q3 1950. Ivo apparently was quite proud of the Chaplin silly name system (Harry had a brother called George Washington Chaplin!) and I think it's unlikely that Harry would have given up the Vernon St Patrick, although anything is possible I suppose.
Harry may well be Ivo's father, but the lack of physical resemblance is quite remarkable. I have photos of both of them and they don't have a single thing in common facially. There's also Olive registering Ivo without a father - no idea why she would have done that. Maybe it took Harry a while to accept that Ivo was his? Also no family as witnesses at their wedding - Harry was witness to George in 1900, so there was family contact up until then at least. George would have been in London at the time, as was Harry's mother and a couple of the other siblings. Possibly having a son out of wedlock in 1904 or taking on a child that wasn't his was enough to put the family off going to his wedding?
Anyway, many thanks for taking the time to have a rake around, it's greatly appreciated.
Suzanne