Thomas Roberts. Certain.

[benny1982]

Hi

Sorry to keep going on about it but am very certain about Thomas Roberts now. From when you look at the dates of the events ie, the birth, and his wife's death and length of illness, and Thomas's remarriage, it all fell into place after that, knowing that the length of her TB would have probably been enough for Thomas to have an affair with Mary Ann Walder in 1863, thus producing my great, great grandmother.

Thomas Roberts was a "Servant and Footman" of Brighton. To refresh from previous posts on the thread about illegitimacy:-

Thomas Robert's wife Esther died of "Phthisis, years, certified" in Brighton, Sussex on 14 November 1863. Mary Ann Walder, Thomas's soon to be wife gave birth to her illegitimate baby Mary Ann Walder Jnr on the 31st December 1863 a few miles away in Warninglid, Sussex. The babe was registered in Sussex on 31 Jan 1864, and then Thomas Roberts & Mary Ann Walder immediately moved to London and wed in West Hackney Church, Stoke Newington on 25th July 1864, so they must have been in the parish for a couple of months beforehand, say, March or April.

One they wed, the babe was baptised at West Hackney Church as "Mary Ann Kate Roberts, daughter of Thomas & Mary Ann Roberts" on 6 Nov 1864, just a year after his wife's death.

The babe was concieved around April 1863 if born late Dec meaning that Mary Ann Walder was around 7 months pregnant when Thomas's wife finally succumbed to her long illness, explaining why the baby was born out of wedlock, because the father's wife had just died 6 weeks before, and buried 5 weeks before the birth.

Mary Ann Walder's grandad John died on the 31st Jan 1864 so Mary would have stayed behind with her family for her grandads funeral and a couple of weeks afterwards before moving to London with Thomas and their child.

I think their swift move to London after the birth was to escape the scandal of the illegitimate birth and the affair back in Sussex, and also to protect the baby.

Despite having to get over 2 deaths, a birth and a move to London, Thomas made an honest woman of Mary Ann as quickly as possible all within 7 or so months.

Ben

[pipsqueak]

Congrats Ben! I' glad you've got that sorted - it sounds very plausible to me

[Marie C..]

Jolly good Benny,
That's sorted then. I think we have a tendency to judge and condemn some of our rellies without taking into account the times in which they lived. They are not here to explain the mitigating circumstances.
So what if they had a few illigitimate babies. Hard -going for the mothers and equally hard for the babies. We can only feel sorry for them. As for those seeking comfort in other arms as their wives were so slowly dying... well men are men and it was ever thus.
And the rich were seeking comfort amongst their own domestic staff whether their wives were dying or not.
Now you can put them all to bed.....
M

[benny1982]

Hi

Thomas would have found it hard nursing a dying wife of TB in their small terraced house in Brighton. No wonder he sought solace in a younger woman. As he was a servant, I do know in the village that Mary lived in, there were several manors in the area and I think Thomas had a servant position at one of those.

Or maybe Mary knew of Thomas through service and she offered to help nurse his sick wife Esther, but her friendship with Thomas went further than simply just "nurse and patients husband", if you get my drift. Esther's burial was paid for by the parish.

At least Thomas did the decent thing by admitting fatherhood and marrying her when he could.

Ben