Ancient Order Sons of the Phoenix

[AnnB]

I have a medal given to one of my husband's ancestors by the John Plato Lodge of the Order of Total Abstinence, Sons of the Phoenix, and dated October 27th 1897. The medal cites him as as a P.C.N. which, I believe, means Past Chief Noble. At the time most of the family would have been living in Islington, North London. I have been unable to find out much about this order, except it was a form of Friendly Society, and had branches nationwide. Does anyone know of a John Plato Lodge in Islington or thereabouts? Or anything more about the Society? The biggest puzzle is that this particular branch of the family are the least likely to have belonged to any such organisation, let alone be a Past Chief Nobel......!!

Best wishes
Ann

[footapper]

I happened to find that one of my forebears was apparently a secretary to this organisation and I set out to find out more about and came across your input - did you ever find out more about this society ? I gather it is some sort of a Freemason society.
I did see that the National Archives have it listed in their inventory and one can send for literature on it.

My society was situated in Hampton in the 1890's

Sandie

[AnnB]

No, I haven't unearthed anything more, except on a site about the Freemason's Museum at www.
freemasonry.london.museum/museum-friendly.htm It would appear that the Museum has some material connected with the Society, despite the fact that it wasn't connected to the Freemasons. I had written to the Freemason's librarian many years ago, to be told that they hdn't got any material and they thought there probably wasn't any in existance, but, obviously, some has come to light! It might be worth getting in touch with them again. I'll put it on my 'to do' list Will keep you informed if I discover anything else.

Best wishes
Ann

[Elouise]

Hi there
I too have a medal which was presented to my great grandfather in 1894. I was told it was given to him because he was teetotal. It also bears the inscription PCN, and having seen your mail I now understand what it means. It is still in the box which is a London masonic jeweller from what I can make out called A Davis in Cheapside, I believe they no longer exist. The lodge is Trafalgar Lodge and I believe the family were at the time quite religious, non drinkers and quite poor although they made the best of themselves.
Have you found anything further out about the organisation? Thought I might try the Freemasons

[AnnB]

Hello Elouise

I am ashamed to say that I never followed up my good intentions to get in touch with the Freemason's again

As I said in my original posting, I cannot imagine how or why my husband's ancestor was given the medal. I cannot imagine any of that particular branch of the family being either religious or teetotal - although they may have been on the poor side!

I really will try and get some more information, but at the moment I am up to my ears in trying to help a friend with their 'tree', which is proving rather a task.

Should you find anything out in the meantime, I would be interested to know.

Best wishes
Ann

[kellybc]

Hi

Having never heard of this society I was intrigued to find out more. Doing a simple Google search came up with some interesting information. There are a couple of references at this site www.
cartes.freeuk.com/history/1858-9.htm

If you're really keen you can purchase "General rules; completely amended. United Order of the Total, Abstinent sons of the Phoenix" @ £45.00

From the Freemasons Library & Museum website comes this dicription - Original Grand Order of the The Totally Abstinent Sons of the Phoenix
This order which appears to have existed from the mid 1800s until just after the Second World War was a temperance order having male, female and junior divisions. Their regalia consisted of a shoulder sash and large jewels for their lodge masters known as ‘grand nobles’. Serving Grand Nobles carried a phoenix topped sceptre as their badge of office. There were splits in the ‘Original Grand Order’ that led to the formation of the ‘United Order’ and ‘Ancient Order’.

There is also a photo of a medal, maybe the one mentioned.

[AnnB]

Helly kellybc

Thanks for those links. It is amazing, when I first searched for the Order on Google (probably a couple of years back) - there was nothing. Then I found mention on the Freemason's site - now you have come up with more. It just goes to prove it is worth going back and searching again

I don't think I shall be buying the book.....and the odd thing is that the medal I have is almost identical to the one pictured above that of the Original Grand Order of the Totally Abstinent Sons of the Phoenix, the one for the Loyal United Friends. Only differnece with 'mine' is that it has a phoenix in the middle. Perhaps they ran out of the 'posher' looking ones

Best wishes
Ann

[primo-buffo]

The temperance movement of the 1830’s, 1840’s and 1850’s saw the birth of many secret fraternal Orders dedicated to total abstinence and temperance. These Orders also served as lodge organisations that offered mutual benefits to their members. The most prominent in Great Britain and the United States in those early days were the Independent Order of Rechabites, Manchester, Egland. The Sons of Temperance, New York, together with two other U.S. based Orders namely the Templers of Honor and the Independent Order of Good Templars (Knights of Jericio).
From 1870 a new order was formed, which was titled The Original Grand Order of the Total Abstinent Sons of The Phoenix. ( OGOTASP ). As with many organisations disagreements between member soon brought about splits, with two further Orders being formed. The United Order ( UOTASP ) and a further unidentified Order ( IJGOTASP ).
Very little is know about the Orders. However, it appeared they were very vigorous temperance groups based mainly in London and the south east of England. Both the OGOTASP and UOTASP soon opened juvenile lodges, which followed on the normal practice of the earlier formed Temperance Orders. Both the Orders admitted women who were known as Sisters of the Phoenix.
Regalia consisted of velvet sashs embellished with silver or gold bullion wire embroidery and silk. Sceptres and breast jewels. The Phoenix Orders were noted for its elaborate and expensive regalia. Jewels were very large, normally silver, with finely executed surface decorations. Jewels of such high quality were presented to male, female and juvenile past officers. Normal ribbon colours for the OGOTASP were Red ( very early ones ). Possibly with the second order being formed and to be more easily distinguished, they were white with a central red stripe/s. The UOTASP ribbons were white with a central blue stripe/s. However, not always consistent to that format. Juvenile jewel ribbons were normally alternating colour stripes of red and white, or blue and white and some even yellow and purple.
It does appear at some period in time the two main Orders may have re-united as there exists artefacts with the initials U&OGOTASP, when that took place, if they still function, or when the Order or Orders ceased to operate is not known.

[AnnB]

Hello primo-buffo

Thank you very much for that (and welcome to BG ).

Strangely enough, I have the medal sitting beside me as I type! I was thinking (yet again) of why my husband's ancestor should have been awarded the medal. Most people's 'black sheep' have some sort of dreadful secret or criminal record, whereas the 'black sheep' of this particular family seems to be the chap who didn't drink and was more goodie than baddie

One of these days I may discover just why he was the only respectable member of the family!

Best wishes
Ann

[conservatory]

I was most interested to read your interest regarding Sonn of the Phoenix.
I have a clock presented to myggrandfather EDWARD BREEN with the following
plaque.

" I.O.C.T"
Presented to BRo.Breen
BY THE MEMBERS OF THE WOKMANS LODGE
AS A TOKEN OF APPRECIATION FOR PAST SERVICES
RENDERED MAY 27th 1887

He was a tailor who lived and worked in the Covent Garden area of London.

In his will he left to his wife " £14 from the Dick Wittington Lodge of the Sons of the Phoenix

Best Wishes Conservatory