How would a post-1818 pension have been paid?

[thewideeyedowl]

Daniel DOWNER, 1791-1862, served in the Royal Wagon/Waggon Train probably during the later years of the Napoleonic wars. He was discharged, aged 27, in 1818 when the Train was reduced to just two troops. His service record is at TNA and also on FMP (but I do not have a sub to the site). He seems then to have worked as a bricklayer, but - on the 1851 census - 'bricklayer' is crossed out and 'Chelsea Pentioner' [sic] written by the enumerator. (He would have been an out-pensioner, and not one who lived in the Royal Hospital, Chelsea; I gather that it was Chelsea that administered the pensions.)

Well, how would he have received the money? Few people had bank accounts. Would he have to have collected it from somewhere? I'm curious.

Owl

[fullscott]

I believe that army pensions were paid at the Post Office, quarterly.

When the Old Age Pension became payable (coupons in a book) at the PO (1908? 1909?) it was weekly, and there were moves to change the frequency of the military payments. I don't know whether they did.

Jane

[simmo1]

Hi

There is a bit of information here - https://www.nationalarchives.gov.uk/r...on-records.htm , but nothing as to how they were paid, unless it is mentioned in one of the reference books listed.
Had quite a good look by googling the terms but nothing comes up?? Yes Chelsea did administer the pensions.
It would be interesting to find out how they were paid, as I had one in my family.

regards

Robert

[thewideeyedowl]

Thank you to you both for those helpful replies. I have just been reading the Research Guide recommended - interesting, but it doesn't get down to the nitty-gritty of how you got your money.

IF service pensions were paid through Post Offices, which seems quite feasible, then how many POs were there, particularly before the advent of the penny post in 1840(?). Were POs administered by the Civil Service? I would guess that some parts of the country had more POs than others, which would have created difficulty for veterans as they got older.

I had wondered whether a pensioner was required to go to his local barracks to collect the money (????).

Feeling very intrigued by all this and think I will have to get a sub of some sort to FMP to find info about Daniel Downer's record.

Thank you again.

Owl

[simmo1]

HI

FMP has this- https://www.findmypast.co.uk/search/a...ce-records/all
but still nothing on how they were paid.
I wonder about the barracks thing also?
Also for FMP you can just subscribe for a month at a time, then you can look at all records on that site - it s about 10 pounds, just don't renew it after the month. Or you an buy credits, but you can use them up quickly!

regards

Robert

[Peter Goodey]

As I understand it, payment of pensions was administered by various district pension offices. Each district had several designated places of payment. Pensioners had to present themselves at the appropriate payment point to collect their money. Post Offices were not involved in the 19th century.

Have a look at National Archives catalogue for series WO22.

For example:

"Bath District: comprising the places of payment, Bath, Frome, Bruton, Corsham, Chippenham, Calne, Wootton Bassett and Swindon"

"Bristol District: comprising the places of payment, Bristol; Temple Cloud; Shepton Mallett; Wells; Glastonbury; Axbridge; Wington (up to 30 September 1847); Somerton; Sodbury; Thornbury; Chewton Mendip (up to 30 September 1846), and Langford (from 31 March 1848)"

and so on.

[thewideeyedowl]

Thank you, Peter - it makes sense that there should be district pension offices/places of payment. I note from TNA that the Bristol and Bath ones covered many of the right villages for my Somerset ancestors. But, to date, have not found any who were involved in any wars. Will continue looking...

Daniel Downer was born in Godshill, IoW, and so too his children, but at some stage moved to Beckenham in Kent. He is at Beckenham for the 1841/51/61 censuses. Have just been looking at the archives for Kent and IoW, through their Record Office sites, but cannot find anything about district pension offices. Perhaps something will turn up one day ?

Thank you again.

Owl

[Peter Goodey]

I don't think they'll be in county record offices. I did suggest WO22. The catalogue doesn't consistently list all the pay offices but does list records for several London districts. Woolwich perhaps or Deptford might have included payment offices near Beckenham.. One would have to spend time at Kew looking through the files.

[helachau]

Hampshire Telegraph 31 July 1858
COUNTY PETTY SESSIONS - Daniel Downer, of Godshill, labourer was charged by Elizabeth Barnes, a very stout, garrulous, old dame with flinging two buckets of water over her and knocking her down; but it appearing that the old lady had first saluted the defendant by calling him "a____ jumped up Bryanite" and then almost deluged him by casting a pot full of slush over him; the Court contenting themselves by fining the defendant half a crown and costs, it being within the knowledge of the Magistrates that the complainant sometimes indulged in libations herself, in which water was not the principal ingredient and that she was not perfectly sober when she asked for the summons

(Bryanite refers to a member of a Methodist Community known as Bible Christians)

[helachau]

"When a soldier is discharged and placed on the pension list his pension is paid to him in the district where he resides, through the Collector of Excise. It is necessary for a pensioner to make a declaration before he can get his quarter's pension. The declaration is made half yearly in duplicate, and in the alternate quarters singly. A duplicate of each declaration is sent to the Hospital* and on its being received, a receipt is made out for the two next quarters' pensions. The receipts are sent to the Collector of Excise to be signed by the pensioner on receiving his money. The pensioners have instructions to attend upon the Collector to receive it and have to deliver the declaration to the Collector, the duplicate in one quarter and the single in the other. The declaration and the receipt are the authority of the Collector to pay the pension, and when the receipt is signed by the pensioner it is the duty of the collector to return it to the Hospital*, and the Collector is allowed to charge in his account the money expressed to be paid by him in that receipt............... Pensioners sometimes make assignments of their quarter's pensions to parish officers and such assignments are authorized by Act of Parliament

(A statement of a Clerk in Chelsea *Hospital 1840 after inspecting Sheffield's pension arrangements)