WW2 - British Civilians in Paris

[herbert]

My husbands great-aunt, born in Derbyshire in 1860, settled in France in the 1920's. She died December 1943 in Paris aged 83 years. Her 'place of abode' was given as Matich.

Could someone please advise how I can obtain a copy of her death certificate? Would she have been interred by the Germans? I have no idea how to progress and I don't speak French.

Thank you, Joan.

[olliecat]

Hi Herbert.

The fact that she died during war tends to complicate the issue and I have no idea if local BMD registration was handled as usual in France whilst they were under occupation. If procedures did remain the same, then her death may have been registered locally and the record held in the local town hall registry. These are deposited after 100 years in the archive relevant to that particular registry and are then accessible to the public. To obtain a record which is less than 100 year old you must prove you are direct descendent.

Have a read of this page on Civil Registers (les registres d'état-civil)...

http://
genealogy.about.com/od/france/a/french_ancestry_2.htm

I would suggest you check the GRO overseas deaths indexes in case her death was recorded through the British Consulate, but this is was wartime, nevertheles you could check.

BTW: Do you know if she died as a direct result of the war?

[herbert]

I obtained the 'Record of the Death of Sarah E Fletcher' from BMD registers. It simply gives her full name - date of death 17 Dec 1943 - place of abode Matich - registration date 21 Dec 1943 - registration town/county Paris, France. Fathers name Thomas Fletcher.

A few years ago I saw, on line, similar details except that the registration place was given as Berlin. We don't know if she died as a result of the war or simply old age.

My intention now is to go to the link that you sent and hopefully find the next step to take.

[olliecat]

I obtained the 'Record of the Death of Sarah E Fletcher' from BMD registers.

Checking BMDRegisters, this is from series RG32/30, Miscellaneous Foreign Returns of Marriages and Deaths from 1940 to 1945. This is what the National Archive says about series RG32 (click the link twice if you just get the catalogue), to quote...

"For the Second World War period some notifications of deaths of members of the services, prisoners of war, civilians, internees and deaths through aircraft lost in flight are included."

It also says...

"The series contains largely non-statutory records relating to births, baptisms, marriages, deaths and burials abroad, and on British as well as foreign ships, of British subjects, nationals of the colonies, the Commonwealth and countries under British jurisdiction. Events affecting some foreign nationals are also included. Records consist mainly of certificates issued by foreign registration authorities, which are in local languages, and copies of entries kept by incumbents of English churches and missions, chaplains and burial authorities. It also contains documents sent by individuals to the Registrar General."

Whether you will find another death certificate, issued and archived locally I don't know, but have a read of the information that I gave you a link to.

[olliecat]

A few years ago I saw, on line, similar details except that the registration place was given as Berlin.

Ah! Are you referring to this registration?

Death
FLETCHER, Sarah E
Consulate : Berlin
Country: Germany
Year: 1941-1945
Vol : 39
Page: 129AA
Age at death: 75
(GRO Consular Death Indices 1849 to 1965)

Well, could be a coincidence! Even assuming that your Sarah died in France but was somehow registered through the Consulate in Berlin, perhaps due to the fact it was wartime, it is the difference in age at death between the two records which would concern me. As an aside, you do know that you can order the above death certificate through the GRO.

[herbert]

I had no idea that I could order a foreign death certificate through the GRO.
The fathers name on the record is Thomas Fletcher (Sarah's father was Rev'd Thomas Fletcher)
She never married and I had wondered if the age on the record was more of a 'best guess' than accurate....

My next move is to order the death certificate from the GRO.

Thank you for your help - I do appreciate it.

[olliecat]

Herbert, I am still doubtful that it is the same Sarah, but I can't be sure and so I will shut up. However, here is some basic information from the the GRO on overseas deaths. Just so you are aware, the death certificate may contain only minimal information such as name and surname of the deceased, date and place of death, the age at death.

Edit: when ordering you could just chance it - or, you could specify the date of death (as you already know this); the GRO will then check this for you and you won't have to pay for the certificate if the date of death is different.

Anyway, crossing my fingers for you.

[herbert]

Thank you so much for sending me the link to the GRO overseas deaths. From RG 32/30 I found the following information:

Ville de Suresnes (Seine)
BULLETIN DE DECES (sorry I don't know how to add the accents)

Fletcher
Sarah Elizabeth
born - Matl?? (Angleterre) Sarah was born in Matlock, Derbyshire.
on - 20 Fevrier 1860

father - Thomas Fletcher
mother - Emily Fletcher

died 17 decembre 1943

L'Officier de l'etat-civil

The birth date and her parents names are exactly as recorded on her birth certificate.