London - Jenkins family query!

[MissClare]

Hi,

I'm very, very new to this - please be kind if I get something wrong.

I've been trying to trace my grandfather's family back, but can't get any further than him!

The little information that I have is that my grandfather was born around the London area (I think Islington, though that could be wrong) and he was called Ernest Jenkins. However, Jenkins was a name given to him by the man my great-grandmother married. I don't know my great-grandmother's maiden name either to look up birth records.
I do know that she was a maid in a large house in the North London area and that my grandfather was born between 1916 and 1921, illegitimately.


Would there be anyway to start unravelling this little mystery? My granddad never talked about it when he was alive and so my Dad doesn't know anything about it either. The whole issue has never been discussed amongst my aunts & uncles, and as far as I know it's all hushed up as the 'family disgrace'. This is only making me more curious, but I'm tearing my hair out trying to think how to start playing Sherlock Holmes!



Thanks all!

Clare

[MarkJ]

Hi Clare - and welcome!

My first suggestion would be to attempt to find the marriage of your great gran and Mr Jenkins. Hopefully, with what you know (grandfather born bvetween 1916 and 1921, plus the name Jenkins for the husband) you may be able to locate some possible marriages.
If you know your great grans first name it would help too!

I suspect your grandfather was simply called "Jenkins" to make things less awkward - but he *might* have been legally adopted. Do you have a copy of grandathers marriage certificate? If so, what does it say for Fathers Name? Is it blank or is there a name?

If you can give us great grans first name, then we could try a marriage hunt.

The most important thing is to gather whatever snippets of information you can. Some will be false hearsay but other bits may provide vital clues for you. It might be worth getting a copy of great grans death certificate. Depending on who gave the details, it might give you her maiden name if we can't dig it up any other way...

[Peter Goodey]

It's not clear what certificates you already have. Who did Ernest Jenkins marry and when? What does the marriage certificate give for his age and father's name?

If you don't have this certificate, you need to obtain it and report back with this information.

Secondly, when did Ernest Jenkins die? Do you have the death certificate?

[MissClare]

Hi Clare - and welcome!

My first suggestion would be to attempt to find the marriage of your great gran and Mr Jenkins. Hopefully, with what you know (grandfather born bvetween 1916 and 1921, plus the name Jenkins for the husband) you may be able to locate some possible marriages.
If you know your great grans first name it would help too!

I suspect your grandfather was simply called "Jenkins" to make things less awkward - but he *might* have been legally adopted. Do you have a copy of grandathers marriage certificate? If so, what does it say for Fathers Name? Is it blank or is there a name?

If you can give us great grans first name, then we could try a marriage hunt.

The most important thing is to gather whatever snippets of information you can. Some will be false hearsay but other bits may provide vital clues for you. It might be worth getting a copy of great grans death certificate. Depending on who gave the details, it might give you her maiden name if we can't dig it up any other way...

Hi!

Thank you very much for the prompt reply!

I'll try to find the marriage - I think my great-grandma's name was Sarah.

I don't have any copies of certificates - I think they're in Australia with the rest of the family (!). Would there be a way of finding these things out online?

I did try looking online for a birth record of my granddad, although that was using Jenkins as a last name, which I assume he wouldn't have been certificated with. That came up with the mother's name as Stephens, which for all I know could be right, but I have a gut feeling that's not the right one.

Basically, all the stories I've heard are along the lines of - my great-grandma went to work as a house maid in North London when she was 16 and met a man who treated her pretty badly. She had a baby out of wedlock, and then met this Jenkins fellow & married him, presumably to make things look better given she was a single mother in early 20th century! Apparently he was horrible and again, treated her & Ernie badly. My grandda left home when he was 14 because he hated the man so much and never went back again, later joining the RAF, meeting Nora then moving to Northern Ireland to be with her, got married in Clogher and joining the Royal Ulster Constabulary. He died in 2010, with my Dad saying something along the lines of 'at least he lived late 80s'. Oh, also he was a member of the Masons, if that would help any kind of search in any way. Probably not. But that really is the extent of my knowledge about my granddad!

All very elusive...

Clare

[MissClare]

It's not clear what certificates you already have. Who did Ernest Jenkins marry and when? What does the marriage certificate give for his age and father's name?

If you don't have this certificate, you need to obtain it and report back with this information.

Secondly, when did Ernest Jenkins die? Do you have the death certificate?

Hi there,

Sadly, I don't have any certificates. I'm not sure where they are - I'm assuming they are in Australia with one of my aunts. (My granddad moved to Australia in the mid 1980s).

Ernest Jenkins married Nora Martin at Clogher Cathedral, Co. Tyrone in the 1940s. I don't have a precise date for it. I'll try and find out some more details on that.

He died in 2011 - I think. It may have been late 2010. All the details from that side of the family are so patchy and we never really discuss it at all so it's very difficult to glean any kind of info!

I'll try to get the family in Australia to dig up some certificates.

[Peter Goodey]

I'll try to get the family in Australia to dig up some certificates.

You shouldn't need to do that for British certificates. You can order certificates (England & Wales) from...

http://www.gro.gov.uk/gro/content/ce...es/default.asp

He died in 2011 - I think. It may have been late 2010

Does that mean he died in Australia? There are more and more obstacles emerging.

Ernest Jenkins married Nora Martin at Clogher Cathedral, Co. Tyrone in the 1940s

Oh dear, another complication. Have a look at the General Register Office Northern Ireland website and see if you have enough information to order a certificate

http://www.nidirect.gov.uk/order-a-b...ip-certificate

Did he have any brothers or sisters? Sometimes you can only find what you need by researching brothers or sisters.

[Peter Goodey]

PS I know nothing about Australian genealogy. I don't know if it's possible to get a certificate or even whether it's worth trying. You may want to pose a specific question about obtaining a death certificate in the Australia forum of this site

[MissClare]

You shouldn't need to do that for British certificates. You can order certificates (England & Wales) from...

http://www.gro.gov.uk/gro/content/ce...es/default.asp



Does that mean he died in Australia? There are more and more obstacles emerging.



Oh dear, another complication. Have a look at the General Register Office Northern Ireland website and see if you have enough information to order a certificate

http://www.nidirect.gov.uk/order-a-b...ip-certificate

Did he have any brothers or sisters? Sometimes you can only find what you need by researching brothers or sisters.

Oh dear, the plot thickens.

He did die in Australia, yes. My aunt from Oz is coming over in two weeks so I can try and get enough information from her to get a marriage certificate from NI.

He has got brothers and they're still living. They're in Wiltshire, but I have no idea of their names. Again, this is another thing I'll try and rectify with my aunt this month. I'm moving to Bristol in October so I'll maybe have to try and find my great-uncles when I'm down there.

It's all so confusingly complicated! None of the rest of my family are this hard to find!


Thanks for all your help, by the way. It's very much appreciated.

[Peter Goodey]

I'd better clarify why I was asking about his death. England and Wales death certificates of this vintage contain the place and exact date of birth. It's not necessarily accurate but usually better than nothing. If you can get that information through any other means, so well and good. Good luck with the Aunt.

[louisa maud]

Between 1917 and 1925 there are 9 marriages between a ? Jenkins and a Sarah ? in the London area
Louisa Maud

Donald, William, David, Frank, James , William J, Frederick, Harry and George, naming christian names, any ring a bell?