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Thread: Josephine Clark

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    Default Josephine Clark

    So, I have hit a brickwall in my family-research.

    Unfortunatly, og fornunatly, depending on how you see it, my search came to a hault with my great-grandmother, Josephine.

    My grandfather is old, and does not remember much about her, other than that her maiden-name was Josephine Clark, before she married my great-grandfather Finn Simensen, a sailor from Norway. If she had a middlename, he does not remember. My great-grandfather and Josephine met in Newcastle, and got married there after a unknow amount of time. This is why everything has stopped in this research. All I know, is her name, maybe only partially, and that she died in Kristiansand, Norway in 1963.

    My grandfather is the youngest of two sons, and is born in 1941. He was not born out of wedlock, so Finn and Josephine married before that time. My grandfather presumes they were married in England, but does not know where or when. He seems to remember beeing to told that they settled for a short period of in the city of Bergen in Norway, after moving there after beeing married.

    Finn and Josephine finally moved to the city of Kristiansand, where Josephine died in 1963.

    This is all I know, and I know even know where to begin looking for her. Is there anyone who can guide me to a place to start in my search of finding Josephine?

    Thank you.
    Hanne

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    Jan1954
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    Hello Hanne - welcome to Brit-Gen,

    I have found the marriage reference as follows:
    September quarter 1940, Tynemouth district, volume 10b, page 603
    Josephne Clark and Finn Simensen.

    However, there is also an entry for Josephine's surname being Wilkie

    Perhaps if you order a copy of the certificate from the General Register Office and just specify Finn's name with the reference details above, the mystery will be solved.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Jan1954 View Post
    Hello Hanne - welcome to Brit-Gen,

    I have found the marriage reference as follows:
    September quarter 1940, Tynemouth district, volume 10b, page 603
    Josephne Clark and Finn Simensen.

    However, there is also an entry for Josephine's surname being Wilkie

    Perhaps if you order a copy of the certificate from the General Register Office and just specify Finn's name with the reference details above, the mystery will be solved.
    Thank you so much for the reply, and the information.

    Can I order the certificate even if I'm a not british citizen? I'm norwegian, so I don't actually have a clue what this certificate means. What kind of information does it give?

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    Jan1954
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    Quote Originally Posted by HaSimensen View Post
    Thank you so much for the reply, and the information.
    You are welcome.

    Quote Originally Posted by HaSimensen View Post
    Can I order the certificate even if I'm a not british citizen?
    Yes, but first please read their FAQs (Frequently Asked Questions)

    Quote Originally Posted by HaSimensen View Post
    I'm norwegian, so I don't actually have a clue what this certificate means. What kind of information does it give?
    Have a look at this, which will explain what is included on a marriage certificate, but do visit all of the topics in the sidebar on the left, starting with this one.

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    Well, I did not figure out how you guys like it here on the forum when it comes to bringing up "old" threads. That is if you prefer that a new thread is made on the issue, or if necroposting is the way to go.

    I'm trying the last one, so correct me if this is the wrong procedure.

    Due to being busy "expanding" the family this last year, there have not much time for research and genealogy. But this month we finally recieved the marriage sertificate (wich is mentioned in the posts above) in the mailbox.

    To be honest, I must say we were a bit dissapointed.

    The document did not hold much information of use, at least not to us. I still find it very hard to figure out the next step on where to look for the Clark-family.

    This is what we have:
    My great-grandfather Finn Simensen, a member of the Norwegian Navy married Josephine Clark (otherwise Wilkie, as it says in the marriage sertificate, whatever that means?) on 22. 07. 1940.
    This happend at the Registry Office in the district of Tynemouth in the county borough of Tynemouth.

    At the time, they were living at 45 Elsdon Street, North Shields.

    Josephines fathers name was Joseph Clark. He is listed in "rank of profession" as merchant seaman.
    He was living at 47 Elsdon Street, North Shields

    We know that Josephine had several siblings. One we know was named May. One of our familymembers vaguely remembers her to have a son named Trevor. There was also a sister named June.

    We also know that Josephine had one son, Joseph, from a earlier "relationship" {birth year removed by mod} when Josephine was only 16 years old. Josephs father is unknown.

    In 1941, Finn and Josephine had a son (My grandfather) while living i Newcastle.

    The family moved to Norway after WW2.



    So... Not much to go on. Where to start? Is there any registered censuses for the area they lived at, were the inhabitants on the adress i listed?

    Not easy, searching for relatives across the borders so any tips or hints on where to look are very welcome!



    - Hanne
    Last edited by Lesley Robertson; 24-11-2013 at 2:29 PM. Reason: person possibly still alive

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    Have a look at the website FreeBMD. It shows a Joseph Clark born in Tynemouth at about the period you mentioned, mother's surname also Clark.
    Does the certificate show her as a spinster (single) or widowed? It was WW2, after all. It might be worth looking for a marriage between her and a Mr Wilkie.

    We don't allow the publishing of information about (possibly) living people on the open forum. Of course, if someone asks for the info, you can provide it via the pm system.

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    (otherwise Wilkie, as it says in the marriage sertificate, whatever that means?)
    On our official certificates, "otherwise" means "also known as". The likeliest explanation is that she had been living with a Mr Wilkie without being officially married to him but used the name of Mrs Wilkie.

    As Lesley asks, her status at the time of marriage for example "spinster" (=unmarried woman) is of interest. Does the certificate show her age? This would help to find her birth.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Lesley Robertson View Post
    Have a look at the website FreeBMD. It shows a Joseph Clark born in Tynemouth at about the period you mentioned, mother's surname also Clark.
    Does the certificate show her as a spinster (single) or widowed? It was WW2, after all. It might be worth looking for a marriage between her and a Mr Wilkie.

    We don't allow the publishing of information about (popssibly) living people on the open forum. Of course, if someone asks for the info, you can provide it via the pm system.
    Thank you for replying!

    First; Sorry for any misunderstandig regarding the information Josephines son Joseph, wich was moderated. I did not put in the post that Joseph died over ten years ago.

    Thank you for the possible explanation on the Wilkie-name. Josephine was listed as spinster in the marriage sertificate. It also says that she was 19 years old when they married.

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    Hello

    On the basis of the information given Josephine CLARK was 19 years at 22 July 1940, her birthdate may fall between 22 July 1921 - 20 July 1922.

    In the UK there is a timeframe in whiich to register the birth, 42 days from the event, therefore we need to look between 1st July 1921 - 30th Sept 1922. A search of GRO lists only 2 with the single name of Josephine

    1) born Southwark London 1d 34 mothers maiden name ( mmn) WILKINSON

    2) Bridge Kent 1922 2a 1516 mmn COULTER

    Neither is near the area Josephine married and gave birth in!

    Do you know Josephine's actual birth date?

    As regards May & June ( both months of the year these sublings could have been born in ) I haven't had any luck in finding them so wonder if they were 'pet names'

    I know if I looked for several of my relatives under the name I know them as I wouldn't find them listed! My own daughter & daughter in law are known as Ellie & Kitty not their birth names!!!


    There are numerous Joseph CLARK listed in the Merchant Navy records

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    Quote Originally Posted by geneius View Post
    Hello

    On the basis of the information given Josephine CLARK was 19 years at 22 July 1940, her birthdate may fall between 22 July 1921 - 20 July 1922.

    In the UK there is a timeframe in whiich to register the birth, 42 days from the event, therefore we need to look between 1st July 1921 - 30th Sept 1922. A search of GRO lists only 2 with the single name of Josephine

    1) born Southwark London 1d 34 mothers maiden name ( mmn) WILKINSON

    2) Bridge Kent 1922 2a 1516 mmn COULTER

    Neither is near the area Josephine married and gave birth in!

    Do you know Josephine's actual birth date?

    As regards May & June ( both months of the year these sublings could have been born in ) I haven't had any luck in finding them so wonder if they were 'pet names'

    I know if I looked for several of my relatives under the name I know them as I wouldn't find them listed! My own daughter & daughter in law are known as Ellie & Kitty not their birth names!!!


    There are numerous Joseph CLARK listed in the Merchant Navy records
    Well, first of all I want to say thank you for taking the time to help! And second, I would like to apologize for making a stupid mistake in my last post. The marriage-date for Finn and Josephine is 22. August 1940, not July. My bad. I'm so sorry for the inconvenience.

    To your questions:

    No, unfortunatly we don't know Josephines birthdate. We was hoping the marriage-sertificate would hold that information (as it does here in Norway) but as mentioned, it only listed her age on the date of the wedding.

    As for May and June, there is a chance that these were pet names. I really would not know. These names comes from my grandfather, who just vaguely remembers them. My grandfather was only 4 years old when the family moved to Norway. He remembers May visiting at least once when he was a child. Josephine died rather young (1963), and the family in Norway seems to have lost touch with their relatives in England after that. At least as far as I know.

    The only papers I have is the mentioned marriage-sertificate for Finn and Josephine, and the birth- and baptism sertificates for my grandfather. I can't that any of the two last documents has anything useful in them, either.

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