Thomas Rogers circa 1853

[sturat]

I have been endeavouring to trace Thomas Rogers born circa 1853 at Sheriff Hill in Gateshead, Co.Durham for over 20 years ! I have even employed 'professional' researchers all to no avail. His birth is not recorded and I cannot find a baptism for him even though some of his siblings were baptised in the Sheriff Hill area and I have even found his fathers baptism and recorded date of birth. What I do know is that he married Elizabeth Pollard on the 11 March 1877 at Tynemouth Parish Church and that he died 25 May 1899 and was buried 29th May 1899 at Westoe cemetery, South Shields where the family then lived. He is recorded in the Census's of 1861, 1871 and 1881 but he is missing from the 1891 probably away at sea as he was an engineer. Even tried records for his occupation. One elusive character is Thomas.
I have traced his fathers grave (John Rogers 17.10.1795 @ Hanley in Staffs) to Bishopwearmouth, Sunderland, but have had no success in establishing his mothers (Ann Jane) maiden name even though I know when she died and where she was buried. I even know his grandfather was named William Rogers from his fathers baptism record.
Any one out there got any ideas?

[Coromandel]

Hello sturat and welcome to our merry band of genealogy addicts

I see that there was some discussion of the Rogers family on a RootsChat thread a couple of years ago:

http://www.
rootschat.com/forum/index.php/topic,439741.0.html

including some interesting census returns (sorry, no references are given and I don't have access to locate them myself right now). I have to agree with some of the other posters on that thread that Thomas's "mother" Ann Jane looks a bit too old to be his biological mother. Is this a case of an illegitimate or orphaned grandson being tacked on to the end of the family? Did Thomas have any "sisters" who were old enough to be his mother?

[Coromandel]

The 1841 census quoted on that RootsChat thread shows a child Elijah Rogers, aged 9, not born in Durham, in the household.

I was having a hunt around to see whether later censuses gave more clue as to his birthplace and so perhaps to where his parents may have married. The LDS 1881 census transcript has a 48 year old Elijah Rogers, iron ship driller, in Bishopwearmouth (RG 11/4989, f.90, p.16). His birthplace is shown as Scotland. Could someone check the census enumerator's book to see if this is what it really says?

I quite like the look of him, as he has a daughter called Ann J. (aged 14, born N. Shields). But this could just be coincidence, of course.

[sturat]

Hi Coromandel.

Yes I am aware of this but believe the 1841 census is an enumerators mistake as the 1851 census shows this person to be Elizah, born Glasgow and I agree that she could be a 'sibling' parent here but without any evidence I am struggling. certainly his marriage certificate gives his father as John Rogers a pot painter. I have been unable to trace an record of Elizah in Glasgow or more precisely Anderton. I believe John Rogers and Ann Jane will have married in or around the Stoke on Trent area which is where they both originated. I presume they moved to Anderton for the potteries there then onto Sheriff Hill by 1834 when a son Charles was born. Quite a trek in those early days and probably by horse carriage. Without a maiden name for Ann Jane its difficult to locate their marriage. Strangely however, John Rogers ended his days in Bishopwearmouth cemetery where he was buried by his son Charles with whom he last lived. So that's a coincidence for this Elijah Rogers who I have no knowledge of.
Thanks for the information.

[Coromandel]

Yes I am aware of this but believe the 1841 census is an enumerators mistake as the 1851 census shows this person to be Elizah, born Glasgow

I don't have access to the census itself, but see from the 1851 index on Findmypast that there is an 18 year old Elijah Rogers (male) in the Gateshead district. Hopefully someone who can see an image of the page could check whether this is Elijah or Elizah and whether it says son or daughter.

[Kerrywood]

1851 census
HO107/2402 folio 439 page 3 (held by TNA, Crown copyright)
Sheriff Hill, Gateshead
John Rogers Head Mar 53 Painter of Eatheren Ware born Staffordshire Handly
Jane Rogers Wife Mar 48 born Staffordshire Stoke upon Trent
Elijah Rogers Son U 18 Potter born Glasgow Anderson
Charles Rogers Son U 16 Painter of Eatheren Ware born Durham Gateshead
Hannah Rogers Daur 11 Scholar born Durham Gateshead
William Rogers Son 7 Scholar born Durham Gateshead
John Rogers Son 4 Scholar born Durham Gateshead
Margt Rogers Daur 2 born Durham Gateshead

[sturat]

Hi Coromadel. Thanks for this. I have re-examined and it appears that I may have made a mistake on the sex issue of Elizah/Elijah. Certainly the 1881 census does throw up some interesting similarities. Daughter Ann J. Well I now know for a fact that Elijahs mother was Ann Jane Rogers and that is confirmed on a John Rogers headstone in Bishopwearmouth Cemetery although she was buried in North Shields in an unmarked grave. It also clarifies the difference in the 1841 census to the subsequent ones where she is only referred to as Jane. Also Charles Rogers another sibling was resident in Sunderland around that time.
However I am still left searching for Thomas's birth or baptism and Ann Janes' maiden name? I will try and find Elijahs marriage to see if that throws up any clues. Long shot but worth the effort.
Thanks again. If you can come up with any more suggestions they will be most welcome. Thank you.

[Coromandel]

I've been having a little look around in bishops' transcripts for Gateshead Fell on FamilySearch. I didn't do a systematic search but did come across this baptism:

Margaret Elizabeth, dau. of John & Jane Rogers, Sheriff Hill, potter, bapt. 21 May 1849 Gateshead Fell (born 14 May 1849)
see register page here.

If you haven't already searched these records it may be useful to do so.

I'd hoped that there might be birth registrations for some of the younger children, as then you could get a birth certificate and find out the mother's maiden name. I can't see one for Margaret Elizabeth Rogers, unfortunately.

Without knowing Ann Jane's maiden name it is difficult to progress. However, one possibility that might be worth following up is this one:

John Rogers married Ann Jane Malpus, 25 June 1831, Newcastle St Nicholas
according to
http://
genuki.cs.ncl.ac.uk/Transcriptions/NBL/MNSN.html

They could be a completely different couple, of course . . . but it's only just across the river from Gateshead and the timing is quite nice considering that Elijah was born c.1832/3. Perhaps the next thing to do with this one is to seek out a copy of the parish register to see if it gives any more information about the bride and groom.

P.S. thankyou Kerrywood for checking the 1851 census.

[Kerrywood]

John Rogers married Ann Jane Malpus, 25 June 1831, Newcastle St Nicholas

Perhaps the next thing to do with this one is to seek out a copy of the parish register to see if it gives any more information about the bride and groom.

The bishop's transcript for that marriage can be seen here.

[sturat]

Hi Coromandel.

Once again thank you for your interest. I have already via Durham County Records Office looked for baptisms and found some of Thomas's siblings. I have commissioned some research for his details in the original registers to no avail. I am now following your possible lead for the marriage of John to Ann Jane Malpus, via <collections@woodhorn.org.uk> and will report the result of that. Interestingly there are two Ann Jane Malpus / Malpuss recorded as born / baptised around the the late 18th century and around the Stoke on Trent area, although birth dates don't coincide with census ages given, so I'm keeping my fingers crossed here. Obviously Thomas's birth, baptism remains my ideal discovery if it exists. Failing that I will have to assume his birth parents as described. He does have Margaret Elizabeth born some 4 years earlier so it is still a possibility as Ann Jane ? may have been only 49 years of age, albeit that rather flies in the face of the malpus (s) connection. Hey ho its off to research we go. Thank you all so much for your interest, most gratefully received.