Francis Robert Thompson and family Bangalore

[Bob Todd]

Hi,
I am trying to trace the records relating to Francis Robert Thompson - Gunner Royal Horse artillery and his family - I know of two born in bangalore Frances Eliza (1881) and Rose Maud (born 1885 - my grandmother). Francis is shown as father deceased on the mariage certs back in the UK (Tynemouth) in 1900(Frances) and 1908 (Rose) respectively. I know they had other siblings Kate, and maybe Millicent (who emigrated to NZ 1910 to 1921) and Frank but unable to find any records for any of them - help would be very much appreciated.
Many Thanks

Bob Todd

[geneius]

Hello

The records you require for the births of the children overseas are Armed Forces Births overseas 1761 - 2005 on FMP

Have you acquired the attestation / army records of Francis Rbt THOMPSON? If not when and where was he born!

Have you found the family on any UK census returns, if so can you post the reference please


geneius

[Sandyhall]

Daugthers Frances and Rose married 2 brothers

Frances married John William W Todd
Found them on 1901 Census with his mother Jane Ann Todd

Rose Maud Married his younger brother Robert Shield Todd
Found his Service Record with names of 3 Children on it but so faded I can,t see the names

[Sandyhall]

Also found both marriages on FreeBMD.

Found Rose Maud Death Mar 1/4 1971 Thynemouth aged 86 it has a birth date of 2 feb 1885

[Coromandel]

This looks like your Frank, from London Parish Registers on Ancestry:

Francis Robert Thompson, 31, bachelor, of 1 King Henrys Rd NW3, army pensioner, son of Francis Robert Thompson (deceased, soldier) and Ada Joyce Hannaford-Durant, 26, spinster, of the same address, daughter of Allen Hannaford-Durant, gentleman were married by licence on 4 September 1918 at St Mary the Virgin, Hampstead. The witnesses were Vivian H. King and Harriet W. Bradbury.

The GRO Regimental Birth Indices on Findmypast have three entries for Francis R. Thompson, all in the Bangalore district in 1887, but each with a different volume and page number. All give the regiment as R.A. so I suspect this is the same birth but for some reason recorded three times. Someone who (unlike me!) understands the process of military birth registrations may be able to explain why.

There are many other Thompson birth registrations in these regimental birth indices. You can restrict the search on Findmypast to those registered on the Indian subcontinent. There doesn’t seem to be a way to search by regiment, but the index entries do show the regiment, so you could trawl through these looking for other birth registrations for the Royal Artillery.

[geneius]

Attestation papers WO97 6068 38
Francis Frank Robert THOMPSON
Royal Regiment of Artillery ( RGA)
Born Bangalore Madras
aged 14 years ( 25/02/1901)
Duke of York Military School Chelsea ( he can be found on RG13 3444 98 20)

5'61/22, on gun muster 5'10" : 91lbs : Fresh complexion: blue eyes: brown hair:
Distinguishing marks: birthmark on left hand & wrist
Denomination CoE

Joined Seaforth 25/02/1901
discharged 22/02/1913
Service Home 1901 - 1908
Jamaica 1908 - 1911
Home 1911 - 1913

Next of kin: Older brothers John ThOMPSON address not known
Willie THOMPSON 2 Olives Court Tynemouth
Younger Brothers Arthur & Richard address as Willie

Other info not included about conduct etc.

Is this the correct person ass daughters are mentioned

[geneius]

The GRO Regimental Birth Indices on Findmypast have three entries for Francis R. Thompson, all in the Bangalore district in 1887, but each with a different volume and page number

Francis R THOMPSON

Looking at the listing there appear to be 3 seperate births, an enquiry to GRO should resolve this!

1) vol 381 page 208
2) vol 1449 page 58
3) 1406 133

extract from GRO.gov.uk information support
Need help deciphering your index reference?
All General Register Office (GRO) indexes are stored on microfiche. If you need help reading the record or microfiche, contact the General Register Office by:

•Post: Contact Centre, GRO, PO Box 2, Southport, Merseyside PR8 2JD
•Phone: +44 (0)845 603 7788 - Monday to Friday 8am to 8pm, Saturday 9am to 4pm
•unclearfiche@ips.gsi.gov.uk
You will be contacted within one working day of receipt of your request. Note that GRO checks the information available in the indexes, but cannot confirm it is the correct entry.

[geneius]

Rose Maud Married his younger brother Robert Shield Todd

Robert signed up on Dec 1915 Nortthumberland Fusiliers married Feb 1907: children Nancy Vera 1908: Stanley 1911: Caroline 1913!

[geneius]

IF( littlew word BIG meaning) #6 is correct, the brothers were born in Northumberland, the mother was Agnes Alice prev MORGAN ( there is a son with this surname) b1859 Berkshire marriage circa late 1880's/1890 Agnes A is a widow on the 1901 census Could be an army widow!

I have found attestation papers that could link this together

Francis THOMPSON b 1851 Southwark
next of kin father Samuel St Pauls
wife Mary Ann BALDWIN married 24/12/ 1877 Southampton, she is recorded as dying 02/07/1888

No mention of any children from either marriage! but both wives appear at sometime to have been with Francis THOMPSON

There are 13 images WO97 4012 101

all courtsey TNA

I did note that he was referred to as Frank, no mention of Robert

[Coromandel]

Good work, geneius! That set of papers in WO97 is packed with information and certainly looks very promising: even though there's no sign of a middle name for Francis Thompson, he is in the Royal Artillery, and goes to India at the right time, and has Tynemouth connections which all fits. Also this Francis died before the 1901 census, which fits with him being shown as deceased on the daughters' marriage certificates.

The first marriage to Mary Ann Baldwin is shown as being at 'Pokesdown, S/hampton' on 24 December 1877
(I think in this case S/hampton means Southamptonshire, i.e. Hampshire. The marriage was registered in the Christchurch district.) He appears to have gone to India immediately after that, and to have stayed there until 1888 (specific locations can be identified from his rather extensive medical record).

The second marriage to Agnes Ann Morgan was at Tynemouth on 14 April 1889 according to the army records. FreeBMD has matching entries for Agnes Ann Morgan and Francis Thompson in the Tynemouth district in the second quarter of 1889 (vol. 10 b, page 358). The 1901 census shows that (besides several Thompson children) she had a grown-up son called William J. Morgan (born in Cork c.1880), so it seems likely she had been married before.

I think Agnes’ maiden name was Crook. The 1861 census has a 3 year old Agnes A. Crook with parents Christopher and Ann and 5 month old sister Selina in Wallingford (all born Wallingford). RG 9/740, f.20, p.33 (census returns Crown copyright, in care of TNA). An Agnes Ann Crook married in the Alverstoke district in the second quarter of 1876. One of the men who appears on the same page of the register (vol. 2b, page 837) is a Thomas Morgan.

Bob, you should be able to get a birth certificate for your grandmother, which should give the mother's name: if we are on the right track here, I'd expect it to say Mary Ann Baldwin.

P.S. can anyone find the family in 1891? They are eluding me at the moment.