ILLEGITIMATE OR NOT ???

[Peter Minter]

I have a problem with a couple of my Grandmother;s certificates.....So could anyone tell me what approach i can take on this please?

Birth Certificate of Dorothy Lydia Skinner on 26-08-17 (Peckham), shows father unnamed.Mother Alice Skinner.
Her Marriage certificate in 1958 states her father as Charles Skinner (Deceased) soldier.
She alway's said she never had or saw a Birth Certificate right to her Death.But she was very adamant, her Father Died before her 1917 Birth,serving in World War 1 as a soldier.I do have some of her photos with a WW1 soldier,looking at his cap badge it looks like Royal Artilliary.However,these photos have ''Rueben Skinner'' written on reverse instead of Charles???
So can anyone advise me of perhaps the most logical or easier route to take to hopefully find more about her father.Why would no name appear on Birth Certicate,but she names him when marrying?

[notanotherminer]

Why would no name appear on Birth Certicate,but she names him when marrying?

Hi Peter and welcome to Brit-Gen

It's wasn't an uncommon occurrence for someone who was illegitimate to name a father at their marriage. I have cases of this in my own families.

Your grandmother may have stated what she firmly believed. Perhaps her father was killed during the war but if her mother wasn't married to him she would have been unable to name him on the certificate. Have you looked for a marriage of an Alice Skinner? If there isn't one in the time frame then she probably wasn't married. If you can find a later marriage it should state what her marital status was at the time.

Have you tried to find either a Charles or Reuben Skinner on the Commonwealth War Graves site? I'll take a look in a minute to see if I can find anything.

The photo' is a mystery. If it had said Charles Smith or some other surname it might have indicated someone who was your grandmother's father but he was killed before he could marry her mother. In that case though his name obviously wouldn't have been Skinner.

I'll look on CWGC and see if I can find a marriage.

[Mutley]

Sadly, many people lied on their marriage certificates often to 'save face' if they were indeed illegitimate.
Sometimes they just did not know who their father was and gave the name of a family member, uncle or someone they knew as a child.

Have you managed to trace Alice? Where was she in 1911?
This is a real detective job, search for Charles Skinner and search for Rueben Skinner and find Alice and try to tie something together. This is a difficult one until the next census is released.

[Lizzy9]

Hello Peter,

Did Dorothy have siblings? Also did she have a stepfather? Any idea when/where her mother was born?

Tell us all you know and we may be able to find some information.

[notanotherminer]

There are 2 Reuben Skinners listed in Soldiers who died in the Great War. I have discounted one from Leicester as your grandmother was born in Peckham.

The other is Reuben Skinner, Sergeant in the Essex Regiment (No. 1888), born Walthamstow, who was killed in action on 15 Aug 1915 at Gallipoli.

According to CWGC he was 21 when he died and was shown as the son of Mr and Mrs Skinner of 146, Winchester Road, Highams Park, Chingford, London.

We need to see if we can link this man as a relative of Alice (possible brother?)

I have looked at marriages for a Charles Skinner and unfortunately there are too many candidates to narrow it down.

[Kerrywood]

Birth Certificate of Dorothy Lydia Skinner on 26-08-17 (Peckham), shows father unnamed.Mother Alice Skinner.

Peter, what is the exact address on the birth certificate? Could it have been an institution, which might have records? Was Alice herself the informant, or was it someone else?

[notanotherminer]

The 1901 census of 2 Camden Road, Walthamstow show Reuben Skinner's parents as George b. 1868 and Sarah b.1870. Although he had 6 siblings none were named Alice.

RG13/1624/5/page 1 Crown Copyright TNA

[Mutley]

The problem with the Walthamstow fellow is that he was born and lived north of the river.
I would rather find a family that were Sarf!

I have passed a Southwark Rueben but there is nothing to tie him in. Rueben is not so common but Skinner is very much so.

[notanotherminer]

Rueben is not so common but Skinner is very much so.

As I found out when I had a look to see where his father George was in 1881. I think I found him (eventually) but no clues there unfortunately.

[Colin Rowledge]

Her Marriage certificate in 1958 states her father as Charles Skinner (Deceased) soldier.


So can anyone advise me of perhaps the most logical or easier route to take to hopefully find more about her father.Why would no name appear on Birth Certicate,but she names him when marrying?

Hi Peter and welcome to the den of Miss Marple and Hercule Poirot.

Since you have the birth cert. I prseume you have her marriage one. What was her status - "spinster' or 'widow'?

I have a couple of instances where both the maiden and married name was the same - e,g. "Lugg".