Hunt for Agnes Jane Scott

[freddie999]

As I ponder over the information I have, I am a little confused. In 1911 Agnes Jane has a husband Henry Graham, her son took this Graham surname, when he was originally a Scott, though Charlotte/Lilian retain her Scott surname. In my previous message I mentioned that in 1914 Charlotte married and her father was named as Henry Scott.

Could it be that the family have been switching between the Scott and Graham surname? Is there any reason people would do this. If they were 'hiding' or trying to get away from the tax man or the police, they have stayed in the same house (22 Duke Street,Carlisle) .

Can anyone explain this?

Thanks

[Mutley]

Freddie999, it seems to come up quite a bit that people switched both first and surnames, not necessarily because they were hiding something but rather that they did not actually know themselves.

Some were illiterate, some illegitimate, some did not know, some invented and to others, it just did not matter.
Many had never seen their birth certificates and could not read them if they did, same applies to marriage certificates.

I think back then, people could choose their identity, rather than these days when identity has to be proved all the time.

[olliecat]

In my previous message I mentioned that in 1914 Charlotte married and her father was named as Henry Scott.

Could it be that the family have been switching between the Scott and Graham surname?

It is quite possible that the family were switching between the SCOTT/GRAHAM surnames for some reason. It may also be the case that when Charlotte married and was asked for the name of her father, she just said Henry, since that was her step-father's name and she either thought of him as her father, or didn't know what else to say (if she was illegitimate.)

Freddie, this has me scratching my head ...

Olliecat suggested I send off for two certificates to tie up my research,

one was a marriage certificate for Charlotte Lillian Scott ...

The other was a marriage certificate for Agnes Scott ...

Whereas, my suggestion was...

I think I'd probably want to get hold of the niece's birth certificate in order to determine who her parents were and exactly how they connect to Agnes. This could her birth...

Births Dec 1910 Carlisle 10b 557
SCOTT Mary A

After that, I'd consider getting hold of daughter Charlottes marriage certificate ...

I am certainly relieved that Charlotte's marriage certificate was the correct one but did you decide against obtaining the niece's birth certificate? I know it was a 'cross your fingers and hope' sort of suggestion.

[freddie999]

I have been struggling with my mother’s grand mother, Agnes Jane Scott, origin, who has been detailed on this site. Tracing Agnes’s birth has been difficult. Census records report her birth place to be Ivegill, and a birth year around 1869. The closest birth found in the records for those details is the birth of Agnes Jane Scott, in 1867 at Macey Bank; which is a small hamlet about a mile away from the village of Ivegill. Hesket Forest is nearby (about 3 miles). Hesket is mentioned as a birth place for Agnes in the 1891 census.

On her birth certificate, the details are included on it are: birth date 7th April, Anges Jane’s mother was Margaret Scott, there was no father recorded. Fortunately, the minister was helpful on the Parish Register and recorded part of her father’s name: all we get was ‘James’ – not much to go on. There was a James Marshall living with Margaret’s family in the 1861 census, working as a farm bailiff, Margaret’s age was 10 in this census, a young mother!

My problem is her death certificate. In this site, there is a discussion about her living at 22 Duke St. and alternating surnames from Scott to Graham. I worked out the year when she died, using the electoral register, and found a death record for that year. The certificate looked great, it mentioned 22 Duke Street, and her son, John Scott, was the informant, both correct. My problem is that on this certificate it states ‘daughter of Adam Scott’
I haven’t seen mention of parents of the deceased, is this usual?

There was an Adam Scott living in Wilson St. in Carlisle in the 1911 census (about 5 miles from Duke St.), born in Dumfriesshire, with a family there which didn’t include an Agnes in the Scotland census.

Can I ignore this statement on the certificate? Agnes’ father may have been an ‘absent father’ who she probably didn’t know. If her son asked who his grandfather was, it would have been difficult for her to answer. Why did he even put her father on the certificate? I want to move on with my research and get this out of the way. Thanks