pub in Birmingham

[SBSFamilyhistory]

Has anyone ever heard of this pub. I found it mentioned in the probate registry with the family name of Burrows,,

thanks

Sue Burrows Simpson

[SBSFamilyhistory]

having just read my thread, I am asking the impossible..

born blonde etc

The pub in question was the Cross Guns in Summer Row

[Geoffers]

having just read my thread, I am asking the impossible.

Not really - Has anyone heard of a pub in Birmingham?

"Yes"!

The pub in question was the Cross Guns in Summer Row

Is there a date (even approximate) for the probate records in which it is mentioned?

[Geoffers]

PS - Modern aerial views of the street (Postcode B3 1JJ) show that at least part has been redevloped.

In 1911 there appear to have been two pubs in Summer Row. The Shakespeare (still standing) and the Waggon & Horses.

In 1881 the only named PH is the Waggon & Horses

[mikejee]

Joseph Mckenna's two books on Central birmingham pubs are fairly comprehensive and cover summerRow. they do not mention the Cross Guns. However there was a Cross Guns at 253 Summer Lane, on the corner of Frankfort St (which is not included in these books as it is not Birmingham Centre). Could this be the one you are thinking of?
Mike

[Geoffers]

there was a Cross Guns at 253 Summer Lane, on the corner of Frankfort St (which is not included in these books as it is not Birmingham Centre). Could this be the one you are thinking of?

Good find Mike - this pub appears in census returns
RG13/2843 f58 p6 (no.252)
RG12/2388 f132 p20 (same address - not named but occuped by a publican)
RG11/2995 f16 p25 (ditto)

1861 - RG9/2161 f90 p8 - No.253 occupied by a retail brewer, premises not named.

[mikejee]

The pub disappeared in the ?Birmingham clearances between 1969 and 1971. If you tell me the period of time of the probate , I might be able to check the directories to see his time as landlord.

[SBSFamilyhistory]

Samuel Burrows died 27/11/1894 with administration being granted to his widow Emma 7/1/1895 he left £141 14s 6d which is worth about £8K to £8.5K Cross Guns "New Summer Street"

Samuel and Emma lived there in 1881 and the address shows as 20 new summer street
they are still there in 1891 but the address is shown as 94, Cross Guns, New Summer Street, Birmingham
in 1901 Emma has moved and it appears that the property is empty RG13 piece 2844 folio 33 page 13
in 1911 no reference is made to the property being a public house....

I think that the road may have been renumbered at some point.....


So if they pub was still there as late as the late 1960's there must be somebody who remembers it.

Sue

PS just looked at the street all run down industrial units now

[SBSFamilyhistory]

Opps just realised what address I have just typed "new summer street" not summer row...... opps

[mikejee]

Its complicated when there are two Cross guns, one in new summer St , the other in summer lane.
The directories show;
Not there, or listed in Birmingham 1867
1868-80 Burrows Samuel, beer retailer, 20 New Summer street
1882-92 Burrows Samuel, beer retailer, 91 New Summer street (this is just a renumbering, no change of premises)
1895-1900 Address not listed, which almost certainly means it is no longer a pub

Mike