navigator/ excavator,how to find before 1860s

[hepzibah]

hi, I am putting this in general, as not sure whether railway, canal, or both apply to the individual! Can someone tell me if there is a differance between a navigator and an excavator. (in an area and time period where canals and railway could both apply) and having first seen mention of a person in the 1860 census, is there any way I can go back further? Thanks to all

[Kerrywood]

not sure whether railway, canal, or both apply to the individual! Can someone tell me if there is a differance between a navigator and an excavator. (in an area and time period where canals and railway could both apply) and having first seen mention of a person in the 1860 census, is there any way I can go back further?

It might be difficult to trace him back using occupational sources, as it is a wide-ranging occupation and may not carry much of a paper trail.

If you post details of name and place and what you already know about him, with census references if you have them, perhaps members could offer some other means of help?

[Geoffers]

hi, I am putting this in general, as not sure whether railway, canal, or both apply to the individual! Can someone tell me if there is a differance between a navigator and an excavator. (in an area and time period where canals and railway could both apply) and having first seen mention of a person in the 1860 census, is there any way I can go back further?

Following the lives of itinerant labouring workers can present difficulties. Tracing further back is possible, where to look depends on what you have found thus far.

As Kerrywood has mentioned, there may not be much paperwork relating to your chap in his work. Your best bet may be to begin with where he appears (is this a census entry?) and seeing if he then shows up in any related paperwork - did he marry a local girl? Where are his chidlren shown as being born and when? (Do these births coincide with construction work in the area?), did he get drunk/into a fight, arrested and appear in a local court whilst working in a particular area?

If you can tie your chap down to a known construction project and a specific company which had a contract in completing the work, you might then be able to trace any surviving company records (e.g. at TNA, County Record Office, with a surviving company), you should be prepared for a lot of work which may yield little result.

A navigator (navvy) could be someone involved in the construction of a canal or railway but need not exclusively have been involved in excavation. An excavator seems to be a little more specific but both would have been generally classed as labourers.

[Keith Goodway]

By 1860, the Canal Age was over (a few still to be built, but the majority of them had been finished well before then), and the Railway Age was in full swing.

If you can tell us where he was, it is possible to see whether there was a local railway being built at that time. The records of some railway companies do survive.

[AnjaliUK]

Does he appear to be missing from the 1841 and 1851 censuses?

[hepzibah]

Thanks for all of your advice. He was in the 1861 census, but I can't find him proir to that, or on the following census. I am assuming ( never do that!!) that he worked with the Great Western Railway, as he was just outside of Swindon. His parents are still in the area in later cencus's. I will dig out the exact info I have on him, as I am just about to start delving properly again. I will post the info on this thread.

[hepzibah]

hello again! can anyone sort this lot out- I can't!!!!

what i have on this is; in 1841 cencus, high st. wootton bassett, wilts. we have letitia pincott, 60 b.1779, husband james pincott,70, b.1769,labourer, not in county, son paul pincott, 25, b.1816,excavation. so i am guessing canals?

also in 1841, we have john pincott 27, ag.lab,living with wife and 3 children in upper greenhill- so i am thinking one of letty's sons

in 1861 cencus, letitia is a pauper, living in w.b. aged 86, and listed as born in lydiard millicent ( letitia's maiden name is tuck.)


in 1841 census there is a jane picott (pincott) b. in wooottton bassett 1811, is she one of letitia's children. in 1841 census jane pincott has married john whiteman, b. wanborough. I don't know where they are living?

i also have luke pincott, b.1822 christend 28, july1822, parents james & letitia, who married 3 feb., 1807. their children were;
aarron b. 1807, eliza, 1809,jane 1811, paul, 1815- d.1887, amos1812, luke 1822

there is also a paul ( letitia's son) pincott, b. wootton bassett1819, residing in knigs lynn, norfolk, in 1851 cencus, listed as a excavator--would this be railways? in 1871 cencus he is a labourer, living at nabley lane- not sure where that is?


then i also have a charles pincott, in 1741, son of thomas, an apprentice blacksmith working for henry avenell in wanborough

so , i know what happened to luke, but am truly stumped to find out where the pincotts came from before they ended in wootton bassett. i have a feeling it might be faringdon area, and arrived in wootton bassett with the canals? this family are a bit of a mystery, as they arrive in w.b. from nowhere, not connected to the big pincott families form gloustershire, as far as i can tell, and seem to be detemined not to be found!

[hepzibah]

sorry- i forgot- i know what happens to paul as well as luke, up until 1911, so it is really where they originally came from, and why, and were they a branch totally unconnected to other pincotts from bordering counties?

[Geoffers]

paul pincott, 25, b.1816,excavation. so i am guessing canals?

A bit late for canal construction in this part of the country. The Wilts and Berks Canal was completed (I think) about 1810-ish - there is a trust to restore the canal and you'll probably find a web-site with a search engine.

I think it more likely that there is a connection with the railway, use a search engine to look for 'Great Western Railway Wotton Bassett' and you may find some detail about when the railway was constructed in this part of Wiltshire which was probably about 1840-ish. I suppose he may posibly have been involved in excavation for the early railway station?

in 1861 cencus, letitia is a pauper, living in w.b. aged 86, and listed as born in lydiard millicent ( letitia's maiden name is tuck.)

Have you been able to find a marriage for the couple? - Weddings often took place in the bride's home parish. The register may give some further clues as to where to look for the origins of the PINCOTT family.

You might also try a search of the 1851 census to see if there are any elderly PINCOTTs living in Wiltshire/Gloucestershire and where they were born. The idea is that althoguh your chap may have moved from his home parish, siblings/cousins may have stayed behond. This may give you an idea of where to begin looking for records.

[hepzibah]

hi- thanks for all of your help and advice. sorry for the delay in getting back on this; i have found a marriage for letitia and james pincott, james born 1769. that is the earliest i can go, so i guess iam trying to find james' parents, ie pincotts ( his parents) living in wootton bassett in 1769. the canal link; if there is one, i am wondering whether it could be james father?

ie. geoffers help; i have looked up all of the cencus's , inc. 1851, for picotts in wootton bassett and found all of the above, except for the following;

would anyone be able to look up aaron pincott, b. 1807, and amos pincott b. 1812. i am not currently a member of ancestry.com.

there were pincotts living in the faringdon area, and they are the ones who i thought we might have a link with- so far none found. there were a large group of pincotts in glousc. area, but no connection to my lot, at least not that i have found so far..in 1851 the only pincotts are the ones already listed in my post. but there are a group in faringdon, that have no found connection to the glous. pincotts, and farindon is only about 10 miles from wootton bassett, so my instincts are telling me there might be a link there. faringdon/ little coxwell canal, and wootton bassett kennet and avon canal, and later of course the gwr. it makes sense to me that if you helped build the canals, you, or your sons, would move on to the railways?