coachman and gardener (domestic)

[Yellabelly]

going back as far as 1730's my grandmas side of the family all came from Lincolnshire and were all but a few farm workers in one form or another. Most of them born within 10 miles of where I was born and bred. My grandma worked the land as a "tate picker" as children we often went with her, even in the 1970's, she didn't need to work then but enjoyed it. I think that even though she was married with great grandchildren by then it was still a part of who she was.

Some of the family moved away from Lincolnshire and not yet got that far in tracing them and some moved abroad in the mid 1800's which I think must have been a big decision to take your family move to another country its big enough now but back then it must have been a major one.

Know when I travel anywhere I look at the fields and think my ancestors worked these fields, when i see the machines they use now I often wonder what would happen to our veg if the machines were taken away - would we stop eating veg !!!

[EVE McL]

Hi

I have 2 people in the 1871,1881,1891 census one is a Coachman the other a gardener (domestic)

What would a coachmans job be back then ?
what would a gardener (domestic) jobs involve would he work for a big house or do garden work for local people ? This was his job for over 40 years !

u

A domestic coachman was employed by a gentry family, having their own stables (or in town a mews where the coachman and family lived above accommodation for carriages and horses. He would drive the family vehicles, mainly horse drawn, including a covered carriage (think Queen going out on State occasion), a barouche, a dog cart, taking the family on shorter journeys, visiting friends or to the station. Some coachmen by the 1890s converted to driving cars, though generally they stuck to what they knew, and a younger man was brought in to drive cars for the younger members of the family.
A domestic gardener was employed by one family, to grow flowers, fruit, foliage, vegetables etc, keep the lawns mown and the gravel drive swept etc. A well to do family in the country could scarcely manage without 16-20 gardeners, from a Scottish head gardener to assistants who actually handled plants, down to garden labourers who humped and hauled earth, grass, stones etc but didn't touch the growing stuff. In town, the family might manage with half a dozen gardeners. Lesser families might have only two, or even pig it with a gardener-groom, whio looked after the gardens and the horse and cart.
A man who worked for different employers as gardener was a 'jobbing gardener'. There were also municipal gardeners in towns who looked after the parks and communal gardens.eve@varneys,org,uk

[Red Dragon]

Any thoughts on why a coachman would move all over the country?

It is possible, if he was employed by a wealthy family with residences at various locations, that he went where the family he worked for went e.g. town house and country house.

[Marie C..]

The above is very likely as the wealthy took a whole retinue of servants including coachmen to their various establishments but coachmen sometimes moved to other places if there were more comfortable positions going.
Many not so wealthy families employed coachmen as did private institutions.
My great grandfather was a coachman for a private family but on marriage went as coachman to the owner of a private mental home(Wyke House in Syon Lane Isleworth) until his death at 33.
As for gardeners well they worked in private gardens or institution gardens. A great uncle of mine was a gardener at Kew before becoming curator of the botanic gardens at Graf Reinet in S. Africa. His brother, my grandfather, was a gardener at a private house for most of his life.
Marie

[helachau]

My wife's grandfather is described over a number of years as follows

1891 Census = groom
1896 Son's B/C = groom
1898 Dau's B/C = groom
1899 Son's B/C - rough rider
1901 Census = coachman domestic
1908 Son's B/C = motor driver
1911 Census = chauffeur domestic
1914 Dau's B/C = motor driver

He reflects the transition from horsedrawn to petrol driven. Indeed, he named his son Daimler.
My wife was told he was a jockey by his sister who even described his "silks". I have yet to find documentary evidence to support this. Has anyone any idea where I might start. This was probably around 1889-1892 when a racetrack (albeit shortlived) was established in Swansea. I have checked the local papers for the time. No mention - perhaps he never won a race.

regards

[Jan1954]

My wife was told he was a jockey by his sister who even described his "silks". I have yet to find documentary evidence to support this. Has anyone any idea where I might start.

A couple of ideas for you.....

Weatherbys - the organisation who know about horse-racing: weatherbys.co.uk/

The Amateur Jockeys Association of Great Britain: amateurjockeys.org.uk/contact/

Put www. in front of each website name.