Your Say Family

[JohnF]

Say, being a common word, is the most DIFFICULT family to search for!

I have trees of Says total 250 Say people.
Let me know:-
WHO you are looking for (father of Fred will do)
WHEN (which century would be a start)

Glad to help if you tell me your interests
John

[pennydog]

Don't know if you can help but one of the 'leaves' on my family tree branch is a marriage of Charlotte Manners b1846 Deptford to a Francis Say ref St Olave 1d305 June quarter 1870. He dies aged 44 in 1897. Cannot find (if) any children, also on 1871 Robert Manners is lodging with a Charlotte 'Sayce', but no mention of Francis. Any info would be great.

[Raffaele]

All the Say children born in the period in St Olave

Births Dec 1870 Say Annie St. Olave 1d 187
Births Sep 1872 Say Robert St Olave 1d 192
Births Jun 1873 Say Sarah Melina St. Olave 1d 216
Births Mar 1874 Say Minnie St. Olave 1d 206
Births Jun 1874 Say Eleanor Elizabeth St. Olave 1d 225
Births Sep 1875 SAY Ann Jane St. Olave 1d 224
Births Dec 1878 SAY William Napoleon St. Olave 1d 288
Births Jun 1890 Say Marjorie Josephine St. Olave 1d 291
Births Dec 1891 Say Lillian Maud St. Olave 1d 242
Births Jun 1893 Say Alfred William St.Olave 1d 249
Births Jun 1894 Say Bernhard Dibdin St. Olave 1d 284
Births Sep 1895 Say William James St. Olave 1d 248

[pennydog]

Thanks for the details of the children, in checking them I found that Francis actually died 1879 aged 50 in Camberwell. Of the children born before '79 only 2 survived Minnie & William Napoleon, but still cannot find Charlotte & Frances on 1871 census. Thanks for your help - it made me recheck and correct my mistakes!!

[JohnF]

Don't know if you can help but one of the 'leaves' on my family tree branch is a marriage of Charlotte Manners b1846 Deptford to a Francis Say ref St Olave 1d305 June quarter 1870. He dies aged 44 in 1897. Cannot find (if) any children, also on 1871 Robert Manners is lodging with a Charlotte 'Sayce', but no mention of Francis. Any info would be great.

Deptford
Today Deptford would be the part of Greater London by the Thames to the East.
But IGI and folk like that speak of "Deptford, Kent"
So beware there MIGHT be another Deptford in Kent, far from London, or maybe, as London grew, it absorbed hitherto pleasant country places.

Here are some names worth your researching:-
Say in Deptford:

say edmund ralph 1774
say james blackwin 1792
say ralph coulson 1800
say ralph coulson 1803
say francis calais 1805
say francis calais 1829
say francis calais 1845

who may be the ancestors of your folk
Let me know if any of these seem "warm"
Happy hunting
John

[pennydog]

Thanks for the info John - 'my' Francis is the Francis Callas 1829 as he died 1879 aged 50. My problem is that I have the marriage ref. in 1870 but they do not appear on the 1871 census. By 1881 Francis is dead and again a Charlotte Say does not appear, but her brother Robert is lodging with a Charlotte Sayce & I am assuming that this is a mis-spelling of Say, but I have no proof, especially as Robert post 1881 marries a Charlotte whose surname I am yet to discover. Lots more to find and any help gratefully recieved.

[JohnF]

Thanks for the info John - 'my' Francis is the Francis Callas 1829 as he died 1879 aged 50. My problem is that I have the marriage ref. in 1870 but they do not appear on the 1871 census. By 1881 Francis is dead and again a Charlotte Say does not appear, but her brother Robert is lodging with a Charlotte Sayce & I am assuming that this is a mis-spelling of Say, but I have no proof, especially as Robert post 1881 marries a Charlotte whose surname I am yet to discover. Lots more to find and any help gratefully recieved.

There are many reasons for people to miss a census and death is not the most common - esp if they reappear later on!
But we MUST make sure which Francis it is!
The one born 1845 is a far better match to your "Charlotte Manners b1846" and she may even be his correct wife.
Here is some info to get your research going on him:

11 Descendants of Edmund Say
-----------------------------
1-Susanna Coulson
+Edmund Say b. x 1700
|--2-Ralph Coulson Say c. 17 Sep 1800, St Paul Deptford, Kent
+Elizabeth Margaret
|--3-Edmund Coulson Say c. 3 May 1807, St Paul Deptford, Kent
| +Sarah Phillimore
|--3-Edmund Coulson Say c. 14 Jan 1798, St Paul Deptford, Kent
|--3-Ralph Coulson Say b. 1803, c. 6 Mar 1803, St Paul Deptford, Kent
+Maria Matilda
|--4-Francis Callis Say c. 15 Jul 1845, St Paul Deptford, Kent
|--4-Ralph Coulson Say c. 30 Sep 1842, St Paul Deptford, Kent

The name Sayce is more common than Say and may be a red herring unless a Say decides to change her name (easy to do).

As for Francis born 1829 , he is the son of
Frances Coles Say born 1805, chr 5 May St Paul Deptford
His mother is Susannah Carr
He was chr 21 Jun 1829 St Nicholas Deptford
He married Catharine Thompson
His brother is Ralph Colston Say
Ralph was born 21 Apr 1834, chr 20 Jan 1837 at St Giles Cripplegate London


You mention a Charlotte Say and I have several who may, one of them, be her.
I have a Robert Say born 1845 who might be the one you are talking about.

[pennydog]

Thanks for all your help, and the information. I think I will have go right back to the start again and recheck all of my information, using the above as a guide. I think I may have been putting too much credence on Charlotte Sayce being Charlotte Say. Hey Ho something to while away the hours when I should be hoovering, dusting, gardening etc!!