Identifying parents (or siblings)

[Xantippe]

There was a Thomas Williamson born to Thomas and Elizabeth christened at the Cathedral Manchester on 28th Feb 1844.

Another on 7th Feb 1844 born to Edward and Margaret.

And yet another at St Thomas Ardwick christened 25 June 1843 born to Thomas and Isabella.

Didn't see any more likely candidates.
Kris

[julielou2]

There is a Thomas Willamson on the 1851 census
HO 107/2226/349/71

9 Sutton Street. St Judes Parish Manchester

Williamson Thomas 44 Labourer
Elizabeth 42
Ellen 12
Robert 13
Thomas 7

I have no idea where St Jude's Parish is.

There is another in Heaton Norris, near Stockport
2 Queen Street.
HO 107/2255/389/30

Thomas 42 Warper Cotton bn Manchester
Ellen 35 -''- bn Yorkshire (I can't read where)
Thomas 8 )
John 6 )all born Heaton Norris
Ellen 5 )


Either of these yours perhaps?

Hello Xantippe and thank you again for your interest and assistance.

I had earmarked the first Thomas (1851 census entry HO 107/2226/349/71) as being the most likely candidate but when I look again at the Heaton Norris born Thomas on HO 107/2255/389/30, that also seems quite possible. I do wonder whether someone born in Heaton Norris would describe himself on later censuses as being born in Manchester. Heaton Norris seems to be more in Stockport but the two cities really do segue into each other.

I have found an entry in Slater's 1869 Directory of Lancashire showing a Rope & Twine business called Thomas Williamson & Son which was on George's Street, Heaton Norris. I know that my grandfather, Thomas Herbert Williamson was a salesman for a rope company, possibly one of the cotton associated family businesses.

This isn't clear cut at all.

In my frustration to try and clear this up I've followed earlier advice in trying to match up all the children called Thomas Williamson in the Lancashire & Cheshire areas through from 1851 to 1871. Still no conclusive, only a possibility. The next question is why is there no Thomas Williamson showing as born in the Stockport registration area around 1843/1844/1845?

THOMAS WILLIAMSON
My Thomas's marriage certificate of Dec 1865 gives his age as 21 giving an extrapolated year of birth of 1844
My Thomas's death certificate of Dec 1909 gives his age as 65 giving an extrapolated year of birth of 1844.

FreeBMD Birth Possibilities:

Sep 1843
WILLIAMSON Thomas Stockport 19 251 - This looks a good possibility so will order next.

Mar 1844
WILLIAMSON Thomas Manchester 20 579 - Already have cert
WILLIAMSON Thomas Manchester 20 571 - Already have cert

Jun 1844
WILLIAMSON Thomas Chorlton 20 244
WILLIAMSON Thomas Manchester 20 581

On 1851 census the possibilities are:

Child's Name Father Mother Spouse Birthyear Birthplace Relation Residence Matching Numbers Matching Letters
Thomas Williamson Benjamin Mary - abt 1844 Runcorn, Cheshire Son Manchester, Lancashire 1
Thomas Williamson Thomas Elizabeth - abt 1844 Manchester Son Manchester, Lancashire 2
Thomas Williamson Thomas Charlotte - abt 1842 Reddish, Lancashire Son Heaton Norris, Lancashire 3
Thomas Williamson Thomas Ellen - abt 1843 Heaton Norris, Manchester, Lancashire Son Heaton Norris, Lancashire 4
Thomas Williamson Joseph Harriet - abt 1842 Droylsden, Lancashire Son Hulme, Lancashire 5 C
Thomas Williamson - abt 1844 Newton, Lancashire Nephew Newton in Makerfield, Lancashire 6 B
Thomas Williamson Thomas Mary A - abt 1843 Parr, Lancashire Son Parr, Lancashire 7

On 1861 census the possibilities are:

Child's Name Father Mother Spouse Birthyear Birthplace Relation Residence Matching Numbers Matching Letters
Thomas Williamson Joseph Mary - abt 1842 Manchester, Lancashire Son Hulme, Lancashire 5
Thomas Williamson - abt 1846 Manchester, Lancashire Boarder Hulme, Lancashire
Thomas Williamson - abt 1842 Poynton, Cheshire Lodger Manchester, Lancashire
Thomas Williamson - abt 1845 Newton, Lancashire Nephew Newton in Makerfield, Lancashire 6 B
Thomas Williamson Thomas Elizabeth - abt 1845 St Helens, Lancashire Son St Helens, Lancashire 2?
Thomas Williamson - abt 1846 Hyde, Cheshire Boarder Dukinfield
Thomas Williamson Ellen - abt 1843 Stockport, Cheshire Son Heaton Norris, Lancashire 4
Thomas Williamson Benjamin Mary - abt 1844 Runcorn, Cheshire Son Salford, Lancashire 1
Thomas Williamson Josiah Mary - abt 1844 Denton, Lancashire Son Bredbury, Cheshire A
Thomas Williamson Thomas Charlotte - abt 1843 Reddish, Lancashire Son Stockport, Cheshire 3

On 1871 census, the definate correct entry is the second entry which seems to match with previous number 4s:

Child's Name Father Mother Spouse Birthyear Birthplace Relation Residence Matching Numbers Matching Letters
Thomas Williamson - - Phillis 1842 Denton, Lancashire Head Bredbury, Cheshire A
Thomas Williamson - - Elizabeth Ann 1844 Manchester, Lancashire Head Manchester, Lancashire 4?
Thomas Williamson - - 1842 Manchester, Lancashire Lodger Manchester, Lancashire B
Thomas Williamson - - 1846 Newton Le Willow, Lancashire Boarder Newton, Lancashire 6 B
Thomas Williamson - - Anne 1845 St Helens, Lancashire Head Widnes, Lancashire 2?
Thomas Williamson - - 1842 Manchester, Lancashire Head Windle, Lancashire
Thomas Williamson - - Sarah 1842 Drylesden, Lancashire Lodger Swinton, Lancashire C

My Thomas Williamson's and his wife's age on the censuses I've located:
Census Year TW EAB TW's Occupation Living At
1871 27 25 Salesman 41, Hamilton Street, Collyhurst, North Manchester
1881 37 34 Buyer Cotton Goods 43, Hulton Street, Moss Side, Chorlton/Hulme, South Manchester
1891 47 44 Commission Merchant - Manchester Trade 43, Hulton Street, Moss Side, Chorlton/Hulme, South Manchester
1901 57 54 Cotton Goods Merchant 3, Alexandra Road South, Whalley Range/Withington, South Manchester

How do people with rellies called John Smith and no idea of father's occupation or name do it?

[Xantippe]

Perhaps for registration purposes Heaton Norris came under Chorlton. It seems to have been a big district. Taking in Whalley Range, Chorlton, Didsbury Withington. So that could be a possibility.

I think I would be looking at the Thomas and Elizabeth in Manchester, as there was a Thomas born to them and christened at the Cathedral in 1844.

Tough one although I have a much less well known name that I can't find either.
Kris

[julielou2]

There was a Thomas Williamson born to Thomas and Elizabeth christened at the Cathedral Manchester on 28th Feb 1844.

Another on 7th Feb 1844 born to Edward and Margaret.

And yet another at St Thomas Ardwick christened 25 June 1843 born to Thomas and Isabella.

Didn't see any more likely candidates.
Kris

I've actually already got the birth certificates of the first 2 as they were the ones mentioned in the 1st quarter of 1844 on FreeBMD. I also didn't update my posting after I'd found that Stockport reg district covers Heaton Norris.

I've also looked again with a fresh head and think that the one christened at St Thomas Ardwick looks promising. My gut feeling is that the child will have a father called Thomas and my gut feeling is also telling me that the first 2 children are wrong because their fathers were a striker and blacksmith respectively and I would expect someone in the cotton industry.

Kris, I'm intrigued - where do you get this information from on which parish each child is being christened?

[Xantippe]

I too have gone with gut feelings and assumptions that the father had the same name as the son, that has led me astray before now, but you have to start somewhere. Do you have the names of the children born to Thomas and Elizabeth that might give a clue as to the names of his parents. I am just throwing out suggestions, I expect you have already thought of that.

You cannot really assume that his father would have the same job, things seem to have changed a lot around the time you are looking. All my Gt Grandfathers seem to have been Ag Labs but none of their sons were. Your Thomas did well for himself so he wouldn't necessarily follow his father but go for a better job. He may not have been the eldest son and apprenticed to his father, like many boys were.

Did you find any of the older Thomas's on any of the census records?

The baptism information comes from the IGI on the Mormon Family history site.

Kris