When and where was John GAUNT born?

[pottoka]

Can anyone please help?

My great-great-grand-father was born in about 1845 but his birth does not seem to have been registered. Depending on the Census, he is given variously as having been born in Digby, Blankney or New Bolingbroke.

According to his marriage certificate, his father's name was Jonas GAUNT, but John never lived with Jonas who only got married in 1851. I deduce that John was illegitimate, but he might have been baptised, so I'm hoping that someone may see his name on a baptismal register.

Otherwise, could his job be another avenue of enquiry? He is an apprentice wheelwright on the 1861 Census? Would it be possible to find out something from his apprenticeship papers, and if so, where should I start to look for them?

This is a new departure for me, so I hope someone will be able to point me in the right direction. I will be grateful for any help.

[Waitabit]

'Morning pottoka, there is a birth reg. John Scoley GAUNT at Spalding (Lincs)Sep. 1845 14-516

A Marriage of Jonas GAUNT at Sleaford (Lincs) to poss. Jane Scholey.. June 1851 ..14-995.

Could this be he?

cheers Wendy

[Geoff Everitt]

From the Sleaford spreadsheet, available here http://s10.freefronthost.com/mi/index.html

14 May 1851 Blankney
Jonas GAUNT (son of Anthony) married Jane ANDREW (dau of Norman John ANDREW)

15 May 1851 Blankney
George BOOLS (son of William) married Jane SCHOLEY (dau of George)

[Pam Downes]

Hi Pottoka,
Welcome to the BG-Forum.

Firstly, I'm not entirely happy with the John Gaunt you've chosen in the 1851 census. I would have thought that someone aged 4 was a bit young to be an errand boy. It is a little difficult to give a definitive answer but I think that the age of that John is actually 14, with the 1 being written extremely closely to the 4. If you look at the other 4's written immmediately above they are written slightly differently - the downward stroke isn't so thick, nor do they have an extra bit above the top of the downward stroke.
The problem is - if this John born New Bolingbroke is aged 14, where does he then disappear to in later censuses? One problem is that Gaunt is ripe for mis-transcription - Gant, Caunt, and Cant spring instantly to mind.
I tried working backwards in the 1841 for a John born 1835 +/- 5 years.
Ancestry (always referred to by forum members as A...y or 'that site' or you-know-know-who because quite often their transcriptions are rubbish) has a John Gaunt aged 6 living in Langton by Wragby with John and Eliza, but he's still with John senior in Langton in 1851.
Next I tried John Gant, born 1835 +/- 5 years.
John aged 4, living in Miningsby with Stephen a shoe maker and Millecent, Charles aged 11, Henry aged 9, Thomas aged 6, and Rebecca aged 2.
In the 1851 census, Stephen and Millicent, with Rebecca and various (younger) children born Miningsby, Bolingbroke and Hundleby, living in Bolingbroke.
Charles, aged 11 in 1841, in 1851 has his name clearly written as Gaunt, and says he was born in New Bollingbroke (sic).
Henry in 1851 is spelt Gant, born Bolingbroke.
Can't find Thomas as Gant or Gaunt.
So I would bet that the John you've found in 1851 is actually the John born c1837, parents Stephen and Millicent.

Which doesn't exaxctly help you to find a baptism for your John, nor to establish his parents. However, if you look at the 1871 entry for the rest of John's household, and then work back to the 1861 census with a certain Elizabeth, you certainly get a link to Jonas.
Still doesn't help you to find your John in 1851 though. I have tried searching for John, born 1845 +/- 5 years in Navenby and Blankney, and just living in Navenby or Blankney, but nothing like Gaunt, Caunt, Andrew, etc. But it could be that John is Jonas' son though not by Jane Andrew.

Ooh, one thing I have just remembered - in transcribing the 1851 census for findmypast (everyone is still busy transcribing, so it's not online yet!) there was one particular page where the parents were say, 29 and 28 but the children were 16, 14 and 12. Oh no they weren't - the children were 6, 4, and 2 (confirmed by reference to the GRO Index). An over-zealous schedule checker had been a little careless with his check marks, so you might want to look for Johns born 1835 +/-5 years too.
Pam

[pottoka]

Hello and thank you all for your replies.

For a long time, I thought that John Scoley Gaunt was my man, but the GRO said the reference was wrong and that they couldn't deliver a certificate. Very recently, I found a death reference to a Thomas Scoley Gaunt in 1850 whom I think must be the same person, and I also tracked down that particular Gaunt family who isn't mine.

John's father Jonas married Jane Andrew in 1851 and thereafter lived with her and had two children with her, Elizabeth (1852) and Charles (1861). He actually made quite a success of himself - no doubt with her help! - as he started out a simple labourer and ended up a confectioner and baker in Louth.

I have never liked thinking that John Gaunt the errand boy was mine, as he seemed to be so far from home, as well as being so young. I agree with your theory that the lad in question was actually 14.

I also have tried Gant, Caunt, Gandy and so on in my search for John in 1851 and, indeed, Jonas in 1841, whom I have still not found. Also, just John living in Navenby or Blankney and born there. One thing I had never noticed, though, was that his sister Elizabeth was living with them in 1871, which does at least confirm that Jonas was their father, so thank you for that, Pam.

Does anyone think that his apprenticeship papers would help, if I can track them down?

[Peter Goodey]

For a long time, I thought that John Scoley Gaunt was my man, but the GRO said the reference was wrong and that they couldn't deliver a certificate.

This sounds to be just a problem in the way the order was submitted. This often stems from entering too much information. I'd try again if I were you

Does anyone think that his apprenticeship papers would help, if I can track them down?

I'm afraid the 1850s are too late to stand any realistic chance of finding a record of an apprenticeship.

[Pam Downes]

Hi Pottoka,
Although Peter's advice about not entering too much information on a certificate request is sound, I wouldn't bother sending for the John Scholey Gaunt certificate at the moment, as I'm sure he's not the John Gaunt you want. Gut feeling, based entirely on the registration district. (Though my gut feeling has been proved wrong on occasions! )
Such as late last night.
I was looking on FreeBMD for John, born Sleaford registration district, 1843 onwards. Found a John Andrew, and two John Andrews. Even more excitement when I found a John Andrew, grandson, aged 7, living with granny and granddad in Lincoln in 1851. And granddad was born in Washingborough (though written as Wash'bro'!) - which is where a certain Jane Andrew, wife of Jonas Gaunt, says she was born. However I couldn't tie up a Jane Andrew baptised Washingborough with the Richard and Mary on the census. And I've just put the kybosh on that particular John Andrew as he's still living with his grandparents in 1861. So another one

(And if I'd double-checked, he was a little too old at 7 anyway!)
I'm hoping to go to London at the end of September and should be able to get access to the PRs for Blankney. If you'd like to send me a reminder about the 20th I can put John's baptism on my list of 'things to do' and while I'm searching for him, I can also check some entries I already have for some of my lot who have connections in Blankney.
Pam

[pottoka]

Pam, I agree. I think John/Thomas Scholey Gaunt's family is one where the parents are Kellham and Eliza, living in Gosberton, which is definitely not the right corner of Lincolnshire. Some of their other children have unusual second names: Deborah Sewell and Thomas Bathanley, so Scholey seems to fit there.

Like you, I am now wondering if John is on the 1851 Census under a different name, presumably his mother's. It might help if I could find his father in 1841, just to know his whereabouts and what he might have been up to. I did promise myself that I would work through the Blankney entries one by one to see if I could find him there, badly transcribed, but the state of the records rather put me off last time I looked and I haven't had the courage since.

Thank you for your kind offer, Pam. Just one thing, if I may, for the reminder, do you mean 20th August or 20th September?

[Pam Downes]

Thank you for your kind offer, Pam. Just one thing, if I may, for the reminder, do you mean 20th August or 20th September?

20th September. I'm scheduled to go on the 27th.
When you remind me, just say 'and don't forget your Woodhalls'. There's a lot of stuff going on in my life at the moment and I barely know what day it is, so I will have completely have forgotten about my lot by then.
Pam

[Geoff Everitt]

Thomas Scholey GAUNT was buried at Gosberton 1 Dec 1850