William Rogers

[gillhussey65]

Hi I've hit a wall with my Gt GT Grandfather William Henry Rogers b.1791 Southill Beds, I think his father might have been a John Rogers b.1770 Cabinet Maker but can not confirm this, on LDS site JOHN ANDREW ROGERS
Christening: 19 FEB 1787 Southill, Bedford, England
Parents:Father: JOHN ROGERS could this be a brother to William, in 1841 cencus William is living in St Andrew the less Cambridge, William served in the 7th Foot Regiment from 1809 until 1838, I have his war records but they are hard to read!
Thanks for any info.
Gill

[janbooth]

Gill,

Bedfordshire FHS has transcribed the parish registers of Southill and they can be bought online from The Parish Chest. From Hugh Wallis's IGI site, it looks as though there are ROGERS in Southill way back to the early 1600s, so purchasing the PR transcriptions could be well worth your while.

Janet

[davidcarca]

Virtually all of Beds pre 1812 has been extracted onto the IGI and all parish registers up to 1812 have been transcribed by Bedford Records Office and are available in either fiche format from Beds FHS and BLARS, or as hard copy from BLARS.

But what's wrong with the William Rogers baptised 16 Oct 1791 at Southill, son of John & Elizabeth, on the IGI? The transcript referred to by Janet adds that John was a farmer, the same as for John Andrew in 1787, Samuel in 1789, and Jane in 1796. As this was the only Rogers family baptising children in Southill at this time it seems very probable that he's the William in Cambridge in 1851

I don't think these Rogers were from Southill though as there are no Rogers in the transcript after a burial in 1708 until John Andrew in 1787. Where was the 1770 birth of John the cabinet maker? I can't see it in Beds, and the occupation of cabinet maker seems a far cry from farmer, and his age makes me question whether he is likely to have been a father by Feb 1887. I can't find a marriage that fits, nor were there burials in Southill of a John or Elizabeth. In fact the Rogers seemed to disappear from Southill! I'll do some more digging and see if I can come up with anything. By 1851 the only Rogers in Southill was Patsey, who I think was Martha, who was lodging with John Faulkner, my 1st cousin 5 times removed. Rogers must be one of the few families in Southill that I'm not connected to!

David

[davidcarca]

Hi Gill,

This is being typed as I work so it might be a bit disjointed!

Looking laterally in Southill for other Rogers there was a Thomas Rogers who married Martha Sarl in 1798 but he appears to have been buried in 1805 with no age being shown. He was otp on marriage. Martha stayed in Southill where she appears in 1841/51. On the IGI there’s a Thomas Rogers baptised 25 July 1779 at Biggleswade, son of John and Elizabeth, which is beginning to look interesting! This John & Elizabeth baptised 4 children in Biggleswade 1779-85 (Thomas, Susan, Sarah, Robert), but in each case John is described as victualler (I have Biggleswade transcript as well, plus a lot more!). Southill parish register shows baptisms of 5 children to John & Elizabeth 1787-95 (John Andrew, William, Samuel, Jane, Lydia –died as a baby).


The other marriage in Southill was Elizabeth Rogers in 1797, to Joseph Chew. Unfortunately she’s not one of the four children of John & Elizabeth baptised in Biggleswade. Equally unfortunately the Beds transcripts do not include witnesses at marriages, as these might be informative.

A census was taken in Southill in 1801 which can be found at
https://www.bedfordshire.gov.uk/Commu...801Census.aspx
Mr Rogers, farmer, had 11 in his household in Broom, 4 males and 7 females.

Playing devil’s advocate let’s say the Biggleswade John, who baptised 4 children, had a career change and moved to Broom, all of 2 miles away, where he baptised a further 5 children, one of whom was dead by 1801, and Thomas Rogers had married and with his family was living separately in Broom. That still only adds up to 9 people. Other houses with lodgers were so indicated in the census.

In 1851 there’s a John Rogers 65 blacksmith living in Dry Drayton, Cambs, who gives his birthplace as Broom, Beds. Broom is a hamlet in Southill so this may well be John Andrew Rogers. (He was also in Dry Drayton in 1841). I get suspicious about coincidences, and that’s two brothers from Southill living in Cambs in 1851, so think I'll have a closer look at Cambs, as I still can’t find burials of John and Elizabeth in Southill, or a marriage, as all of the other John/Elizabeth marriages are accounted for.

There were very few Robert Rogers’ around and no marriages/burials or census appearances in Beds that match. But there is a Robert Rogers age 42 buried at Bourn, Cambs on 14 Feb 1827, “of Long Stanton”. (I’ve also got ancestors from Bourn so happen to have this transcript as well). The Robert baptised in Biggleswade was in 1785 so the age fits. Bourn to Biggleswade is about 11 miles. There’s a marriage in Bourn on 20 Sept 1773, John Rogers and Elizabeth Darlow. This couple baptised Elizabeth Rogers on 28 Dec 1777 at Bourn……and then no more. What odds this is the Elizabeth who married in Southill in 1797?

An Elizabeth Rogers age 83, widow of John, was buried at Bourn on 25 Dec 1836. But where’s John buried???

Bourn PR has been extracted onto the IGI so you can easily double check all the Bourn references.

Looks feasible so far, but proving it might (WILL) be a bit more difficult!

But guess who was living in Bourn in 1851 – loads of Chews born in …..BROOM, Beds. Said I didn’t like coincidences. The earliest Chew in Bourn PR is the baptism of John Chew in 1805, son of Elizabeth Chew, baseborn. I can’t find a burial of Joseph Chew, but it looks as though this is Elizabeth Rogers who married in Southill. There’s an Elizabeth Chew who married William Saywell in Bourn in 1818 (William widower, no marital status for Elizabeth, one of the witnesses was David Darlow), and they appear in Bourn in 1841, William 65, Elizabeth 63 born in Cambs, plus Elizabeth Chew 40, Catherine Chew 30, Jane Chew 10, Mary Chew 6, John Chew 3.

I’m sure that if you follow the other Rogers children born in Biggleswade and Sarah they’ll probably lead you to Cambs. Needs a lot of work to prove it all, but it hangs together.

Shout if you need anything checked

David

[gillhussey65]

Hi David and Janet thanks for your promt replys, I can't remember where I got John 1770 from now, prehaps I was clutching at straws on one of the web sites, I really need to get to Beds Record office but children to young at mo, to get a chance. I will look through your replys and see if I can piece anything together, William Henry Rogers son Arthur Samuel Rogers was b.1846 New St. St. Andrew the Less, and on it his dad married a Mary Ann nee Gordon this was in Birmingham Dec 1838 William was discharged from the army in Nov 1838 at Dublin, Mary Ann was born in Jersey so another brickwall! Mary Ann was listed as nurse in 1861 and 1871 William is listed as color Sargeant pensioner 1851 and Chelsea Pensioner 1861 so I persume they met when he was injured?
Thanks again
Gill

[gillhussey65]

On a similar subject my husband has ancestors born in Northill William Toy b.1850 his father was Jesse Toy b.1808 Northill his father William Toy b.1786 Northill, spooky our ancestors were villages next to each other!
Gill

[Juliet Byrnes]

Hi, I've hit a similar wall following the Rogers's of Potton. There was a Rogers family cluster from about 1770s to c. 1830/40s in Potton. The furthest I can get back is John 'the Elder' Rogers - a cooper in Potton. He died in 1829 and was born in c.1754. He had a sister call Ann - later Page. I've looked in and around the area and seem to come back to either Northill and Southill is most probably where he was born. Interestly his sons became cabinet makers. One of his sons was William b.1779 and married Jemima Baldock.

Hope it helps

Kind regards

Andrew

[andrewfr]

Dear Andrew,

John "The Elder" was my 4th gt grandfather. (BTW, where did you find the details calling him "The Elder" and his trade as a cooper?)

I believe he was born in Campton, Bedfordshire in 1753 and died in Potton in 1829. He married Elizabeth White in 1778 and they had 7 children. I have quite a lot of detail. Send me your email address and I will reply with a GEDCOM of my research.

Best regards,

Andrew Francis Race Rogers.

[davidcarca]

If you’re referring to the marriage of John Rogers and Elizabeth White at Croydon cum Clapton, Cambs, in 1778, there are two big leaps of faith here, unless there is further evidence to support the hypothesis!

1. That it was John Rogers of Campton who married Elizabeth White.
2. That it was this couple who were the ones who baptised children in Potton


1.If the Croydon marriage entry states “John Rogers of Campton” then you’re home and dry. If not there’s a more likely marriage for the Campton John Rogers, to Elizabeth Devonshire, at Meppershall, next door to Campton, in 1777. There’s no John Rogers baptised in Meppershall. There’s a John Rogers age 86 buried at Meppershall on 18 Jan 1838, which is also pretty well spot on for a baptism on 19 Feb 1753. There’s also a John Rogers buried in Campton in 1779 whose baptism I can’t trace. Campton and Meppershall parish registers really need checking to see exactly what they say about the various John Rogers entries. Both the Potton and Meppershall couples named their first son William, the Campton John’s father. So traditional naming patterns could apply to either

2.It’s much more likely that the Croydon couple were the ones in Potton, less than 8 miles away. Croydon parish register has been extracted onto the IGI and there are no Rogers baptisms, and the first Potton baptism is at the right time. In fact there are no earlier Rogers entries in Potton, at least not after the 1600s, so John must have been from another parish. But I don’t know which one!

David

[andrewfr]

Hmm. Since I posted my rather overconfident opinion that JR was from Campton I have received a copy of his will (1828) from a newly discovered 3rd cousin. In the will he clearly states that he has a sister named Ann. The Campton JR seemingly had no such sister.

Back to the files!

Andrew