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Diane Grant-Salmon
19-10-2004, 7:03 PM
Does anyone have any Ancestors with these surnames please?

CLEGG - Originally from Emley, then to Overton and Middlestown
NAYLOR - Originally from Emley, then to Flockton
FAWCETT - Originally from Heckmondwike
HAMPSHIRE - Originally from Flockton
DICKINSON - Originally from Flockton
HINCHCLIFFE - Originally from Ossett & Dewsbury

andrew
10-12-2004, 9:50 AM
My CLEGG connection in that regions starts with Thomas CLEGG who was bapt on 14 Nov 1680 in Thornhill by Dewsbury
He married Elizabeth NICHOLSON on 4 June 1707 in Thornhill
They had 4 daughters, Mary, Lydia, Elizabeth & Ann

Diane Grant-Salmon
24-12-2004, 11:19 AM
Hello Andrew,

Sorry I haven't replied to this thread earlier, but been having a few problems of late. Unfortunately, I don't have your names in my file ...... shame, as it would have been nice to connect our Families. :)

Jan Kingshott
30-01-2007, 8:28 AM
Does anyone have any Ancestors with these surnames please?

CLEGG - Originally from Emley, then to Overton and Middlestown
NAYLOR - Originally from Flockton
FAWCETT - Originally from Heckmondwike
HAMPSHIRE - Originally from Flockton
DICKINSON - Originally from Flockton
HINCHCLIFFE - Originally from Ossett & Dewsbury
Hi Diane,

My wife is a Dickinson whose ancestors hail from Flockton and one of the early Dickinson family members married into the Clegg family of Emley.

I would be very interested in working out our links to each others family.

I look forward to hearing from you soon.

Best Wishes

Jan B Kingshott
Exeter, Devon, England
jankingshott AT blueyonder DOT co DOT uk

Diane Grant-Salmon
30-01-2007, 8:44 AM
Hi Jan,

Don't you remember sending me this email on the 23 March 2006? :)

Hi Diane,

I am sorry for the delay in replying to you.

Here are the details of the early DICKINSON family that I have. I wonder at the significance of the name Joseph, compared to your early Joseph.

My wife descends from Fred Dickinson, number 25, then his son James number 50. James was her grandfather.

Would it be possible to see what you have on the family? I would appreciate it.

Regards

Jan

Diane Grant-Salmon
30-01-2007, 5:19 PM
Hi again Jan,

I've just received this in an email from my brother ..... he no longer deals with family history. :cool:

From: Jan Brian Kingshott (address deleted)
Sent: 29 January 2007 19:47
To: Alan.Forrest (address deleted)
Subject: CLEGG family of Emley


Hi Alan

I found your e-mail address on a Clegg researchers website. My wife is a descendant of this family, and I was wondering if you would be interesting in sharing some information to enable me to build on what I know.

I look forward to hearing from you soon.

Regards

Jan

Linda
30-01-2007, 5:27 PM
Oh I didn't notice this before Diane! I also have a kind of Dickinson connection with my Clegg family! |laugh1| (Or did I already tell you about that one :o )

Wrong area of course, just like the Cleggs :( , and wrong era - my grandma Robinson, who married Joe Clegg in 1921, married Arthur Dickinson in the 1940's.

I can still be your "little sis" though |hug|

Diane Grant-Salmon
31-01-2007, 8:55 AM
Hi 'lickle sis' Linda |hug|

No, you didn't mention any Dickinson connection before, so that's new.
We are very unlucky aren't we? Both trying desperately to find a connection to each other, via one line or another.

I haven't had time yet, to add you as my adopted sister, to Family Tree Maker, but hopefully, things won't be so manic at this end, for much longer. ;)

Diane Grant-Salmon
29-11-2007, 6:36 AM
Seeing as I've just edited my first message, (added an area to my NAYLOR family) ...... I thought I'd 'bump' this thread up, seeing as there are many new members now. ;)

Jay Webb
28-08-2008, 6:29 PM
I have lots of families all from Emley , Shelley , Kirburton , Barnsley area. Mostly from Emley though

I have a Mary Silverwood(b. Apr 1830-Emley) married to James Clegg (b. 1826 Emley)

Children:

Sam( b. 1852)
Thomas (b. 1854)
Ann( b. 1856)
Harriet (b. 1859)
Amy (b. 1862)
Hannah ( b. 1865)
James (b. 1867)

Any connections?

Diane Grant-Salmon
29-08-2008, 6:17 AM
Hi Jay,

You missed two! :D

Alice bap. 28 Jan 1849 and Joseph Silverwood born 01 Jul 1872 at Emley Moor, bap. 01 Sep 1872 - he was bur. 14 Mar 1874 aged 20 months.

I assume you are a descendant of Thomas CLEGG m. Amy MUFFET then? They are not my direct line, but if I can help in any way, just ask.

Jay Webb
30-08-2008, 12:35 AM
Hi there,

My husband is a decendant of Benjamin Silverwood (b.1831) who was Mary ( nee Silverwood) Clegg's brother.

His Grandmother was Evelina ( Silverwood) Webb(b.1895-Barnsley)

His line goes Evelina>Isaac>Benjamin>Joseph Silverwood
Mary Clegg> Joseph "

Mary ( Silverwood) Clegg's children would be 1st cousins to Isaac Silverwood (b. 1862)

How are you related?


Jay:)

Diane Grant-Salmon
30-08-2008, 11:51 AM
Hi Jay,

James CLEGG bap. 31 Jul 1825, is my 3rd cousin 4 times removed, so a very distant relationship! ;)

My direct CLEGG line is:
William m. Alice BEDFORTH
Richard m. Sara DITCH
John m. Elizabeth UNKNOWN
Nathaniel m. Grace WILCOCK
William m. Elizabeth SHAW
Charles m. Susannah HAMPSHIRE
William m. Rachel ALLOTT
William m. Mary Ann WHITLAM
John m. Alice ODDY
Sidney m. Louisa NAYLOR
Eleanor m. Joseph Albert FAWCETT
Ivy FAWCETT m. Walter Allan FORREST
Me

I did all this research at Wakefield Archives from 1994-1999, but I have 'branched out' on all these families, since that time.

Jay Webb
31-08-2008, 12:46 AM
Benjamin & Sarah ( nee Armitage) Silverwood's two of their children married Fawcetts too


Daughter=Mary Silverwood( b. 1857-59) married Henry Fawcett

Son- Cornelius ( or Neal)(b.1859-Hoyland) married Mary Fawcett

I may be wrong but I assume Mary & Henry Fawcett to be siblings?


I am not sure about the information you just gave? You show 11 generations of Clegg's but I don't see a James Clegg listed? Am I missing something?

I have this information about Sarah ( Armitage)Silverwood's death

"Sarah (nee Armitage), who was born in Skelmanthorpe around 1835. She died
15th January 1913.She was 78 and died of Bronchitis and Heart Failure. She died at 122 Upper Hoyland which was Mary Silverwood and her husband Henry Fawcett. The house was then a farm , with barns and cattle sheds. It is still standing but is now a big house."

Bye for now


Jay:)

Diane Grant-Salmon
31-08-2008, 9:39 AM
Hi Jay :)

I'm afraid I can't help at all with the FAWCETT's you mention, as I have nothing in my file about those marriages. My lot were all from Heckmondwike, Birstall area.

The 11 generations listed ....... they are my direct line and the James CLEGG who married Mary SILVERWOOD, is just an extended branch of the family, to me.

These are James CLEGG's ancestors ...... the ones marked with a * are the 'shared' ancestors'.

Thomas m. Amy MUFFET
John m. Elizabeth UNKNOWN
Robert m. Margaret TAYLOR
William m. Elizabeth SHAW *
Nathaniel m. Grace WILCOCK *
John m. Elizabeth UNKNOWN *
Richard m. Sara DITCH *
William m. Alice BEDFORTH *

cmichals
31-08-2008, 9:37 PM
Hi,
I am researching a William Dickinson B 1808 in Flockton atm. William marries Mary Burdekin. I think William's dad is a Joseph Dickinson, but I am not sure about any details about Joseph at present. Maybe you have come accross this line before?
Carla

Diane Grant-Salmon
01-09-2008, 9:52 AM
Hi Carla,

Will you give me any more information you have please? There are a couple of problems, the first being that there are two William DICKINSON's baptised in Flockton around this time:

William bap. 09 Sep 1808 Flockton - son of Joseph
William bap. 10 Dec 1809 Flockton - son of Thomas

The second problem is, I have a James Dickinson who married Sarah Ann Brunyard, on the 15 August 1858 Castleford ...... this James is the son of the William b. 1808 and his first wife, Mary.

cmichals
01-09-2008, 1:21 PM
Hi Carla,

Will you give me any more information you have please? There are a couple of problems, the first being that there are two William DICKINSON's baptised in Flockton around this time:

William bap. 09 Sep 1808 Flockton - son of Joseph
William bap. 10 Dec 1809 Flockton - son of Thomas

The second problem is, I have a James Dickinson who married Sarah Ann Brunyard, on the 15 August 1858 Castleford ...... this James is the son of the William b. 1808 and his first wife, Mary.

All this information is the same as what I have found. I am probably not providing enough info. I will try with more details :o

My direct line follows Emily Dickinson 1871-1952. Emily marries Peter Smales Cockerham 16 Oct 1887.
Emily Dickinson is the daughter of James Dickinson (1835-1893) and Sarah Brunyard (1841-1911).
James Dickinson is the son of William Dickinson 1808-1868 that I was talking about (the one that was born in Flockton). William marries Mary Burdekin (weird name ;)) in 1833.

I hope that is a bit clearer. Do you have more details about William and his father Joseph? Which dickinson families are you descended from?

Carla

Diane Grant-Salmon
02-09-2008, 12:51 PM
William Dickinson 1808-1868
Carla

Hi Carla,

Thank you for the information. I have William's first marriage to Mary BURDEKIN, on the 14 April 1833 Thornhill and she died sometime between 1851-1861 in Castleford, (too many possible deaths on FreeBMD).

William's second wife was Amelia BEECH and they married between Oct - Dec 1861 Pontefract Registration District.

I don't think you have some of the census returns, as you list William's death in 1868. Possibly, he died Oct - Dec 1884 Stoke T. Reg. District Vol: 6b Page:117 - aged 76 yrs. Possibly, Amelia died Jul - Sep 1891 Stoke T. Reg. District Vol: 6b Page: 98 - aged 81 yrs.

I'll list three census returns in my next message, in respect of the above ...... I assume you have the 1841-1861 returns for William? If not, just ask.

I'll get back to you when I can, in respect of William's parents ....... as some of the info I have been given by someone else, re his and his siblings parentage, just doesn't add up, so I'm doing some checking.

My connection to the family is a little further back. My Sarah DICKINSON bap. 10 Sep 1749 Flockton m. John NAYLOR. Sarah was the daughter of Joseph DICKINSON bap. 26 Dec 1724 Flockton m. Mary CLEGG.

Diane Grant-Salmon
02-09-2008, 12:52 PM
CENSUS APRIL 1871 Ref: RG10/2861/19/34
Dwelling: Ash Road, Townsend, Bucknall, Stoke on Trent, Staffordshire

William DICKINSON (62) Head Marr Grocer & Provision Dealer b. Stockton, Yorkshire*
Amelia (60) Wife Marr Grocer & Provision Dealer's Wife b. Scotland
William (20) Son Single Accountant b. Castleford, Yorkshire
William ILLINGWORTH (15) G.Son Single Potter b. Hanley, Staffordshire
* Should be Flockton, Yorkshire
__________________________________________________ ______

CENSUS APRIL 1881 Ref: RG11/2721/40/6
Dwelling: 47 Werrington Road, Bucknall, Stoke on Trent, Staffordshire

William DICKINSON (72) Head Marr Grocer b. Ploxton? Yorkshire*
Ammelia (70) Wife Marr Grocer & Provision Dealer's Wife b. Scotland
* Should be Flockton, Yorkshire
__________________________________________________ _______

CENSUS APRIL 1891 Ref: RG12/ 2168/115/21
Dwelling: 19 Clifton Street, Hanley, Stoke on Trent, Staffordshire

Hannah BRADSHAW (39) Head Widow b. Hanley, Staffordshire plus 6 children
Amelia DICKINSON (80) Grandmother Widow b. Scotland
_________________________________________________

cmichals
02-09-2008, 3:51 PM
Thank you very much. I would have ordered the death and would have found another wrong certificate. Then I would have searched again, but Stoke on Trent...ahhh :confused:

I do have the 1841-61. I plan to order the first wife's death certificate soon so wish me luck....maybe I will get it first time :o

I will add these extra details to my tree and see what other problems I have. Look forward to seeing their certificates. I love the causes of death...studied pathology with my biochem and tox degree and find the changes in causes over time really interesting.

Thank you again
Carla

Diane Grant-Salmon
02-09-2008, 7:42 PM
Hi Carla :)

I'm pleased I managed to help you!

I didn't enter any of the information I was given, into 'my file' ....... I put it in a folder, as I couldn't connect it to my bit of the DICKINSON family. Therefore, I didn't study it, until you posted your message and the thing which really caught my attention when I looked, were these two entries of the nine children listed, for a Joseph DICKINSON m. Ann BLACKLEY:

William Dickinson, born Bef. 18 Mar 1797 in Flockton, Yorkshire, England.
William Dickinson, born Bef. 09 Sep 1808 in Flockton, Yorkshire, England.

I can't find a death for the first William and I have found out that there are two families, whereby both Joseph's were born in Flockton (1768 and 1786) both married to Ann's (BLACKLEY and WIRING). Therefore, I have my doubts as to whether your William b. 1808 belongs to the Blackley girl. The other Joseph (1786) m. Ann WIRING on the 26 Oct 1807 Thornhill and on the 1841 Census for your William, this couple are living next door.

In my next message, I'll put some census returns for you ...... they are correctly typed out, but all the little notes on them are my thoughts, in respect of baptisms I have found etc! ;) :D

Diane Grant-Salmon
02-09-2008, 7:43 PM
CENSUS JUNE 1841 Ref: HO107/1270/ 7/11/17
Dwelling: Middlestown, Yorkshire

Willm. DICKINSON (30) Coal Miner b. In County
Mary (25) b. In County
James (6) b. In County
Edwin (4) b. In County
Ann (3) b. In County
Martha (1) b. In County
Jno. SUGDEN (15) Cl. Mr. App. b. In County
R.? PELL (15) Cl. Mr. App. b. In County
* Living next door to a Joseph DICKINSON - see census below - William's parents?
__________________________________________________ __

CENSUS JUNE 1841 Ref: HO107/1270/ 7/11/17
Dwelling: Middlestown, Yorkshire

Joseph DICKINSON (55) Labourer b. In County
Ann (50) b. In County ................................nee WIRING?
Thos. (25) Labourer b. In County ................ the one bap.11 Feb 1816 in Flockton?
John (20) Blacksmith b. In County .............. bap.17 June 1821 in Flockton?
Hannah WIRING (7) b. In County
__________________________________________________ ___

CENSUS MARCH 1851 Ref: HO107/2326/24/40
Dwelling: Middlestown, Yorkshire

Ann DICKINSON (66) Head Widow Annuitant b. Flockton, Yorkshire
George HARGREAVES (26) Son Marr Coal Miner b. Heaton, Yorkshire *
Elizabeth HARGREAVES (22) Daughter Marr b. Flockton, Yorkshire
* Should be Son-in-Law
Elizabeth married George Hargreaves Apr-June 1849 Dewsbury Reg. District
__________________________________________________ ___

CENSUS MARCH 1851 Ref: HO107/2330/293/53
Dwelling: Castleford, Yorkshire

Thomas DICKINSON (35) Head Marr Lab. b. Flockton, Yorkshire
Ann (23) Wife Marr b. Ryhill, Yorkshire
__________________________________________________ ___

CENSUS MARCH 1851 Ref: HO107/2330/286/39
Dwelling: Castleford, Yorkshire

William DICKINSON (42) Head Marr Labourer b. Flockton, Yorkshire
Mary (35) Wife Marr b. Horbury, Yorkshire
James (15) Son Single Miner b. Middlestown, Yorkshire
Edwin (14) Son b. Middlestown, Yorkshire
Ann (12) Daughter b. Middlestown, Yorkshire
Martha (11) Daughter b. Middlestown, Yorkshire
Sofia (9) Daughter b. Middlestown, Yorkshire
Emma (7) Daughter b. Ledsham, Yorkshire
__________________________________________________ ____

Diane Grant-Salmon
03-09-2008, 10:16 AM
Ooooooh Carla! |woohoo||woohoo||woohoo||woohoo|

I think I've managed to connect you to my Sarah DICKINSON!

Back later.

Diane Grant-Salmon
03-09-2008, 10:53 AM
Hi Carla :)

Now I've got over my excitement and come back down to earth ...... we have to take things one step at a time, don't we? Sort out the existing stuff I wrote about yesterday first! The best thing is for me to list the info I have in one message, for you to absorb it ....... then other messages with what I've just done with it ...... then you can let me have your thoughts on it.

From my baptism & burial transcriptions, (except for one!) of the children of Joseph DICKINSON:

1. Ann bap. 18 Dec 1791 Flockton - Father: Joseph
2. Elizabeth bap. 19 Jan 1794 Flockton - Father: Joseph
3. William bap. 18 Mar 1798 Flockton - Father: Joseph
4. Mary bap. 31 May 1807 Flockton - Father: Joseph
5. William bap. 09 Sep 1808 Flockton - Father: Joseph
6. Sarah bap. 03 Mar 1811 Flockton - Father: Joseph
7. Jane bap. 11 Aug 1811 Flockton - Father: Joseph
8. Joseph bap. 07 Mar 1813 Flockton - Parents: Joseph & Ann - Abode: Flockton Father's occ: Mason
9. Mary bap. 21 Nov 1813 Flockton - Parents: Joseph & Ann- Abode: Flockton Father's occ: Miner
10. Thomas bap. 11 Feb 1816 Flockton - Parents: Joseph & Hannah - Abode: Flockton Father's occ: Miner
11. Richard bap. 12 Apr 1818 Flockton - Parents: Joseph & Hannah - Abode: Flockton Father's occ: Miner
12. John bap. 17 Jun 1821 Flockton - Parents: Joseph & Ann - Abode: Flockton Father's occ: Miner
13. Robert bap. 25 Jan 1824 Flockton - Parents: Joseph & Ann - Abode: Flockton Father's occ: Labourer
14. Elizabeth bap. 12 Oct 1828 Flockton - Parents: Joseph & Hannah ...... (IGI true extraction entry)

Diane Grant-Salmon
03-09-2008, 11:55 AM
Hi Carla :)

I have now entered all this lot in my file, as it's easier for me to work on in there. I've just allocated 12 of the 14 baptised children to both families ....... but not Sarah and Jane, both born in 1811 as I haven't a clue as to who belongs to whom!

I was helped by the fact that Joseph DICKINSON was buried 08 Oct 1815 Flockton, Yorkshire - Aged 47 yrs. so this fits the Joseph bap. 28 Sep 1768 (son of John) perfectly.

His family first:
Joseph b. 1768 m. Ann BLACKLEY in 1791 - their 5 children:

1. Ann b. 1791
2. Elizabeth b. 1794
3. William b. 1798
4. Mary b. 1807
5. Joseph b. 1813

Second family:
Joseph b. 1786 m. Ann WIRING in 1807- their 7 children:

1. William b. 1808
2. Mary b. 1813
3. Thomas b. 1816
4. Richard b. 1818
5. John b. 1821
6. Robert b. 1824
7. Elizabeth b. 1828

cmichals
03-09-2008, 12:57 PM
I have only gone quiet as I am trying to process all the info into my tree. Will let you know how I go. May not be until late tonight!!
Thank you for all this information....wow |bowdown|

Carla ;)

Diane Grant-Salmon
03-09-2008, 4:32 PM
Hi Carla :)

Don't worry about that, as I shall be going quiet for the rest of the week possibly. I'm trying to get some gardening done in between showers, not to mention housework, which has been neglected completely yesterday and today. ;)

When you have time, (next month!) you'll have to put your *deep* thinking cap on, because if you agree with my thoughts on this one ...... it will mean that your William bap. 09 Sept 1808, is my 2nd cousin 4 times removed!

Joseph b. 1786 m. Ann WIRING, are aged 55 and 50 in the 1841 census and as you know, ages are often/usually rounded down in this census. In 1851, Joseph has popped his clogs and Ann is listed as aged 66 years old. This means that she was born c. 1785, so I had a look at my transcriptions. Within that approximate time, there is only this:

Hannah WIRING bap. 21 Jan 1787 Flockton - her father is Thomas.

Seeing as Joseph is listed as being 5 years older than her in the 1841 census, things didn't look so good then, seeing as he was born a year earlier. I thought I'd better check to see if I could find another one and this one seems more likely to be the correct one, so please let me know what you think?

Joseph DICKINSON bap. 24 Nov 1782 Flockton - his father is William.

If they stuck to a very common naming pattern, i.e. naming first born son after father's father, then second born son after mother's father, then this would mean that this Joseph b. 1782 is more likely to be Hannah/Ann's husband, as he is also five years her senior. Not all generations stuck 'strictly' to the naming pattern though, so we must take that fact into account also.

Having totally given up at this point, of being able to connect *your* Joseph, with a father of John, to *my* Sarah's brother, John |sad1| ....... I checked my index then, to see if I had a William anywhere in it, who could be a possible father to this 'new' Joseph.

I found one, born in 1755, who married Mary in 1779, so I clicked on 'Go to the family page'. There are no children listed for this couple in my file, so I clicked on William's parents to see who they are. It's a good job that I wasn't drinking a cup of tea at the time, as I would have had a splattered monitor (as have other members on here, many times!) :D

Parents - Joseph Dickinson m. Mary Clegg ........ he's also the brother of *my* Sarah!

cmichals
03-09-2008, 11:23 PM
After finally getting my family to bed I started going through the census and IGI records. I took a look at the Joseph's bap in Flockton in that period. I found 2 as you stated. The good news is that in the IGI records the 1786 Joseph (son of John) actually provides a death with it for approx 4 years later, which should mean that the 1782 Joseph (son of William) is a very good candidate to being my relation. |biggrin| I also think it is very likely due to the naming and ages provided in the census returns as you have previously stated.

I also looked up Ann/Hannah Wiring and came to the same conclusion that the bap in 1787 given the census ages and area seemed very likely. It is all coming together very nicely. Just need to follow Sarah and Jane through to see if we can match them to the correct parents and I need to look into that bit that connects the family with yours |hug|

I don't know if the marriages will provide any useful info for the parents of Sarah and Jane? The parish records seem to vary hugely depending on the parish. I have the Rothwell one's for my Morrill/Morrells and it is quite limited, but over in gloucestershire (forest of dean in particular) there is loads of info!

Will let you know how I go with the next bits of the Dickinson saga.
Carla :)

Diane Grant-Salmon
04-09-2008, 10:39 AM
Hi Carla :)

You were up late! I'm pleased that you managed to find things out on the IGI ...... I do use it myself too as a guide, but not everything is on there of course as you know. It's great that you found the death of Joseph b. 1786 on there, so I looked at my Flockton transcriptions and found the burial there too. I've now changed my file to Joseph b. 1782, as being married to the WIRING girl.

To give you a little more info from my file:

William DICKINSON bap. 22 Jan 1755 Flockton m. Mary SPIVEY on 25 Nov 1779 Thornhill ...... have just checked with the IGI and although this marriage is on there a couple of times, they are only LDS submissions ...... however, the date is correct.

Both of this Parish
William signed his name and Mary made her mark.
Wedding witnesses: Jonathan Lockwood & Sykes Batley

The IGI states that Mary was b. Abt 1758 Thornhill, but I can find no baptism for her in Flockton or Thornhill , five years either side of that date.

Diane Grant-Salmon
04-09-2008, 7:18 PM
Hi Carla :)

I forgot to tell you that re the marriage of Joseph to Ann WIRING:
Both made their mark
Wedding witnesses: Joseph Mountain & Robert Clegg

Guess what? When I clicked on this message thread, I clicked on the start of it by accident, so I thought I'd read it from the top. Silly me ....... I forgot all about Jan posting a couple of messages! His wife is connected to you, so I shall send an email straight away, as I have the address in my book.

It will be nice for three of us to meet on here, won't it? ;)

Jan Kingshott
04-09-2008, 9:35 PM
Hello everyone,

I've been away for a while and understand that you are discussing "my" DICKINSON's again! Nice to hear it. I still haven't managed to get to the original parish records yet, so the information that I have on them is a best fit based on transcripts at the moment. It is therefore open to challenge, revision and re-interpretation. It is all good to enable us to get as near to the truth as possible.

It is going to take me a couple of days to work through the thread and try to work out what everyone is talking about, so bear with me. If someone wants to help me out by sending me a direct message with the findings so far, please do so! jankingshott AT blueyonder DOT co DOT uk is the direct e-mail. It would certainly seem that Carla is fairly closely related to my wife (formerly a DICKINSON herself).

As an interesting aside, I work in the police in Exeter. I am a custody sergeant at the moment and one of the solicitors is a Vernon Clegg, who talks in a broad Yorkshire accent. I asked him a few questions and, unbelievably, he is related to the same CLEGGS that the DICKINSON family married into. Small world.

Bear with me also, as I have an exam on Tuesday and am currently studying all hours.

Regards

Jan

Jan Kingshott
04-09-2008, 11:21 PM
Hello again - s*d the revision!

I've had a look through the posts and compared it to my tree. It would appear that the conclusions that you have drawn are exactly the same as those that I have drawn. There tends to be a lot of revision on my tree as I conduct further research, and I must admit that I've moved people around since I originally looked at the family. The fact that we came to the same conclusions independently suggests that we must be on the right tracks at least!!

A couple of additional bits of info for you:-

Joseph DICKINSON bap.24/11/1782 was buried 06/01/1848 at Flockton.
Hannah DICKINSON bap. 21 1 1787 was buried 02/11/1859 at Flockton, although her age appears to have been erroneously recorded as 77 years.

I've still got masses to do on the DICKINSON's yet. Perhaps we can trade trees? We can all then view each others and benefit from the collective critique? Direct e-mail would be best as I like to keep things fairly private.

Anyway, going forward a few generations on my wife's, and Carla's line, you reach the marriage of James DICKINSON to Sarah Ann BRUNYARD. The BRUNYARD family are the family that I have been actively researching of late, with the aid of masses of primary resource material and the benefit of an unusual surname!

I've not managed to find anything, however, on the BURDEKIN family, who that James DICKINSON's mother belonged to. Does anyone have any information on them? They seemed to come from Horbury, Yorkshire.

Anyway, I suppose I'd better do a bit of revision before bed!

Cheers for now

Jan

Diane Grant-Salmon
05-09-2008, 6:38 AM
Hi Jan,

I'm wondering now if I did the right thing, writing to you direct last night ........ Carla and I will have to be careful that we don't upset you ....... as we may both end up in *your clink*! ;)

Please give Vernon my regards, from one Yorksher Clegg to another ....... he must belong to the 'brainy' side of the family. :D

Good luck with your exam and don't worry, Carla and I will still be here when you get back! It will help a lot, if three of us try and work out who belongs to whom in the Dickinson family, as many hands make light work and all that. In this case though, that's rubbish ...... as like you, I'm struggling with just transcriptions and we all know that they're not always correct.

I expect our ancestors are all having a good laugh at our expense, but there again, delighted that three of us have 'met up' at BG Forums!

Perhaps you and Carla may prefer to correspond direct, in respect of your BRUNYARD and BURDEKIN families, as I'm not connected at all to them, so I'm not researching those names ........ it's bad enough with the ones I am!

cmichals
05-09-2008, 2:13 PM
Hello Jan and Diane,
I am feeling the pressure...too many Dickinson's. Don't even mention the word Burdekin 1815?? |banghead| The only Mary Burdekin's in Horbury I can find are in 1808 and the 1820's.

Anyway, after calming down I have some little bits I have found. I think Mary Burdekin's burial as a Dickinson is 4 Nov 1860 aged 45 (I really wish the age had been different!). Grave number 137 at castleford old cemetery for anyone who wants to visit |biggrin|. I am going to order the death certificate...as I love the gory details, but maybe this will confirm this a bit more.

I have also got their son, James Dickinson (burial 14 May 1893), being buried at the same cemetery number 136 with his wife Sarah Ann Brunyard (burial 23 May 1911).

Diane, thank you for the extra info re: the wedding ceremonies. I am very hopeful about our connection by Jospeh's father William B 1755. I am still working hard on adding the Dickinson children, but will take time out to order some certificates...will let you know how I go.

Carla :)

cmichals
05-09-2008, 4:29 PM
Oh dear,
I think Hannah Wiring/Dickinson may have resurrected |scold|
I have found her living with her daughter in the 1861 census.

RG9 3417 Folio 87 pg 4
Wakefield registration district
In the lovely Shitlington ;)

George Hargreaves B 1825 Kirkheaton
Elizabeth Hargreaves B 1829 Flockton
and children
Hannah Dickinson B 1786 Flockton formerly a miners wife Mother-in-law


I think the most likely death with the information I have atm is OND 1861 in Wakefield, but this is under Ann Dickinson?


Better get back to records :)
Carla

Diane Grant-Salmon
05-09-2008, 6:34 PM
Hi Carla :)

D*mn it ..... I typed her burial date in this morning, so I've just shot back and deleted it!

After finding her in 1851, I didn't have time to see if she'd lived until the next census. I don't know how you work in your file, but in the death date part, I type in: Aft. 30 March 1851 etc. so that I know I have to search in the next census and so on, before trying to find any death dates.

Thanks for the info and have a good weekend. :)

Diane Grant-Salmon
09-09-2008, 11:44 AM
I'm still around ....... just a bit besieged at the moment, as I have found a new contact for my FAWCETT families from Birstall area. :)

Whilst the two of you are sorting out your connected families, when I can, I'm going to start wading through transcriptions, trying to find more Dickinson ancestors, as I only had a couple further back from *my Sarah* ...... direct line only. I'll list here what I have in my file, so you'll know what I'm talking about.

William Dickinson bap. 22 Jan 1755 Flockton bur. 27 July1787 Flockton - his parents:

Joseph Dickinson bap. 26 Dec 1724 Flockton bur. 20 May 1796 Flockton m. Mary CLEGG 22 May 1746 Emley. Mary bap. 04 Oct 1724 Emley bur. 06 Jun 1795 Flockton. Their children:

1. Mary bap. 25 Jul 1746 Flockton
2. John bap. 06 Mar 1748 Flockton possible burial 03 Apr 1806 Flockton?
3. Sarah bap. 10 Sep 1749 Flockton bur. 23 Apr 1793 Flockton (wife of John NAYLOR)
4. Margaret bap. 29 Sep 1751 Flockton
5. Thomas bap. 03 Jun 1753 Flockton bur. 05 Jun 1753 Flockton
6. William (as above)
7. Thomas bap. 12 Mar 1758 Flockton bur. 04 Aug 1822 Flockton - Aged 64 yrs.

Joseph Dickinson bap. 26 Dec 1724 - his parents:

Thomas Dickinson bap. 19 Apr 1696 Thornhill (abode Flockton) m. Margaret Taylor 07 Apr 1724 Thornhill. Margaret bap. 20 Dec 1707 Thornhill (abode Netherton)

Thomas Dickinson bap. 19 Apr 1696 - his father, Joshua

That's all I have, so I'm trying to find any further children for Thomas & Margaret.

Diane Grant-Salmon
09-09-2008, 4:12 PM
I can't find any more children for Thomas & Margaret at Flockton, but I did find this:

Margaret bur. 03 April 1751 Flockton (wife of Thomas Dickinson) ........ so son, Joseph, named his daughter after her - Margaret bap. 29 September 1751 Flockton! :)

cmichals
09-09-2008, 5:49 PM
Hi Diane, :)
I have been working through Emily Dickinson's (B 1871) siblings. Have got most census and marriage info, just need deaths.

I entered in Joseph Dickinson and Mary Clegg and the flood gates opened up!! |5cups|

Anyway, from your list I seem to have the same info, but also have Thomas Dickinson's parents: Joshua Dickinson 30 Nov 1665-06 Jan 1711 in Flockton and marriage to sarah Brooke 16 Apr 1678 Thornhill. Let me know if this fits with what you have found?

Carla

cmichals
09-09-2008, 6:56 PM
Joseph Dickinson bap. 26 Dec 1724 Flockton bur. 20 May 1796 Flockton m. Mary CLEGG 22 May 1746 Emley. Mary bap. 04 Oct 1724 Emley bur. 06 Jun 1795 Flockton.

Diane, I have a contact who states that Mary Clegg's burial was 03 Jul 1803 in Flockton, Yorkshire. Can you have a look and tell me what you think??
Thank you
Carla :)

Diane Grant-Salmon
09-09-2008, 8:01 PM
Hi Carla :)

Thomas DICKINSON bap. 19 April 1696 - bur. 29 April 1772 Flockton.

I did make a start on looking for the above Thomas's father, Joshua. In my transcriptions and on the IGI, Thomas is listed as having only Joshua as a parent ....... ignoring the three LDS submissions of Sarah BROOKE being his mother.

The marriage of *a* Joshua Dickinson to Sarah Brooke on that date, is in my transcriptions, (both of the parish of Thornhill) and Anne, daughter of Joshua Dickinson, of the Lodge, was bap. 24 December 1678 Thornhill. This Anne was bur. 16 Feb 1679 Thornhill ...... but no abode listed this time.

Sarah, the wife of Joshua Dickinson of the Lodge, was bur. 23 Dec 1678 Thornhill, so it's almost certain that she is Sarah Brooke, as I have a few in my families, who baptised a child the day after their wife was buried. One cheeky so-and-so had both done on the same day!

I think Thomas's mother is Sarah PARKER m. Joshua DICKINSON 05 Oct 1682 Emley. She was bap. 14 Nov 1660 Emley,( daughter of George & Grace) and she was bur. 04 Aug 1728 Flockton. I have the same burial date for Joshua as you list - bur. 06 Jan 1711 Flockton, but as yet ...... not a clue as to when he was born. Where did you get that date from?

I have 6 siblings for Thomas b. 1696, (from 1683 to 1702), but that's as far as I got.

I'm logging off now, but I'll carry on lifting out the transcriptions for Flockton when I can. :)

Diane Grant-Salmon
10-09-2008, 6:40 AM
Diane, I have a contact who states that Mary Clegg's burial was 03 Jul 1803 in Flockton, Yorkshire. Can you have a look and tell me what you think??
Thank you
Carla :)

Hi Carla :)

It's very difficult to assign deaths/burials to the correct person, as a lot depends on the information given in the Parish Register. Sometimes, there's nothing other than just a name with no clues, so that's why many of my lot have Unknown for a death date! ;)

I had to choose between these two dates, as both would be *correct* if Joseph died in 1796 ....... knowing my luck, I've made the wrong choice! However, until or unless I can find another Mary Dickinson who fits the bill, or Joseph's death date is wrong, I'm leaving my entry as 1795.

If your contact can help on this, please let me know ....... who have they listed for the 1795 death?

Mary Dickinson - Wife of Joseph bur. 06 Jun 1795 Flockton
Mary Dickinson - Widow bur. 03 Jul 1803 Flockton

cmichals
11-09-2008, 10:30 AM
The data I received about the Dickinson's was given to me at one of the family tree events by a fellow researcher. It is the first time that I have even looked at their tree details (I completely forgot I had it :o). I will try and contact them, but it has been a while! They go back even further on the dickinson line.

Interestingly, I have been looking at the A------- website and there are also lots of trees on your Naylor and Dickinson line stating the same Sarah Brookes etc. Apart from the copying, which I am sure there is lots of, I wonder why Sarah Brookes has been chosen over Parker and why the death is 1803. Someone must have had a reason?! Especially as you say it seems to be entered by someone on LDS as well.

Looked at my NBI, but unfortunately not the right area in Flockton is covered. It would have been great to find some ages at the death as that would help provide confirmation.

Carla :)

Diane Grant-Salmon
11-09-2008, 11:11 AM
Hi Carla :)

I just popped in to leave you a short message, but I found your message here when I arrived!

I don't look at the trees anymore on Ancestry, after spending one day looking ..... most of them are rubbish!

I think people chose the Sarah Brooke marriage, possibly because the timing was right, the marriage was at Thornhill and things *fit*. Didn't they notice the five year gap between the first born child in 1678 and the next one in 1683? That's what made me suspicious. ;)

Anyway, I popped back to tell you that the burial of 03 Jul 1803, at Flockton, of Mary DICKINSON - a widow ........ fits for Mary SPIVEY, the wife of your William b. 1755. :)

OK ...... can't prove it, but that's what I'm doing in my file, unless someone can prove otherwise! :D

cmichals
11-09-2008, 11:31 AM
Ok, it is always good when you have a look yourself. I have been searching through Thornhill and Emley registers. What a nightmare! |jedi|
I can see that Joshua Dickinson and sarah Parker get married in Emley, but kids aren't christened in Emley..yikes. Haven't looked at the Flockton, but looks like the Thornhill marriage between Joshua Dickinson and Sarah Brooke fits with the christenings in Thornhill, therefore I conclude like you that Parker looks like the better option.

Good to hear we have a person for the extra Mary Dickinson death. Thank you for all the info. It is a bit tricky with these records as they really don't tell you anything!

Carla :)

Diane Grant-Salmon
11-09-2008, 2:32 PM
Hi Carla :)

Emley and Flockton are a *spit* away from each other, if you'll excuse the expression! :D

Netherton, Overton and Middlestown are also a *spit* away from each other and Thornhill (the Mother Church for some of these Parishes) isn't that far away from Middlestown. I know all this, as I used to cycle from one village to the other when I was a kid, as I had relatives living in all those places. The only problem was cycling back from Thornhill to Middlestown, as the hill is very, very long ....... OK for coming down 'like the wind' but I ended up walking half of it, on my way back! |sad1|

I didn't know you had access to Ancestry ......... I downloaded all the transcriptions for Emley, Flockton & Thornhill Parishes to my computer, some years ago, then it took me ages to rename each page with the years at the top! Doing that, at least I know where each particular year is on the long list.

Then, I extracted all my CLEGG and NAYLOR surnames from Emley and Flockton ........ but I only got halfway through for Thornhill. I didn't do the DICKINSON family at all.

The children of Joshua & Sarah were baptised at Flockton. Seven of them, unless I've missed some!
1. John b. 1683
2. Joseph b. 1685
3. Samuel b. 1691
4. George b. 1693
5. Thomas b. 1696
6. Sarah b. 1699
7. William b. 1702

Diane Grant-Salmon
11-09-2008, 3:22 PM
Hi Carla :)

I've just popped back to tell you something else:

Sara bap. 11 Sep 1659 Thornhill. She's the daughter of Edward BROOKE of Thornhillees (Thornhill Lees).

I can't find a Joshua DICKINSON baptism from 1650-1660 at Thornhill, so I'm no nearer to knowing who 'this one' is and I think I've hit the proverbial brickwall, in trying to find him.

In one of my booklets of FHS Index of baptisms, (for Emley) from 1600-1723, according to them, there is only one DICKINSON variant in this time era ..... for a Thomas DICKESON bap. 24 June 1655. His father is Peter and the abode is Thor ..... presumably Thornhill.

cmichals
12-09-2008, 1:53 PM
Diane,
Thank you for the info. I have some info from the certificates I sent off for.

I'll start with William Dickinson (1808 Flockton- 1884 Stoke T).

His second marriage to Amelia Beech:
5 Oct 1861 in the Wesleyan Chapel Horsefair Pontefract.
William Dickinson aged 52 a widower works as a labourer at glass works. Residence at Welbeck Street, Castleford. Father Jospeh Dickinson a labourer.
Amelia Beech aged 51 a widow. Residence at Welbeck Street, Castleford. Father Thomas Naylor a Potter.
Witnesses Thomas Oare and Robert Ingleby.

I guess you knew she was a Naylor? I thought it rather surprising when i read that!! :D
Ok got a death for William:
12 Dec 1884 Werrington Road died aged 76 a collier. Cause of death Diabetes Mellitus (very vague |snore|). Informant Amelia Baggaley step daughter present at death living at Providence Square, Hanley.
Will now send another post with more info :cool:

cmichals
12-09-2008, 2:14 PM
......Now Mary Burdekin (Abt. 1815-1860). William Dickinson's (1808-1884) first wife.
Died 1 Nov 1860 in Welbeck, Castleford (fits nicely with the burial I gave you...I am planning to come up to Yorkshire to see these grave stones, if they still exist!) aged 45. Wife of William Dickinson a glass bottle blower. Cause of death apoplexy for 6 hours (:confused: an old medical term when someone dropped down dead and they didn't know why. Sometimes used if they though internal bleeding was present, but could have been an aneurysm or heart problem etc.) Informant was a W Banks from Welbeck, Castleford.

Joseph Dickinson (1782-1848)
Died 3 Jan 1848 in Shitlington aged 66 a miner. Cause of death inflammation of the lungs for 3 weeks. Informant Peter Thornton in attendance from Shitlington.

James Dickinson (1835-1893)
Died 12 May 1893 Lock Lane, Allerton Bywater aged 58 a journeyman glass blower. Cause of death cancer of the bowel. Informant John Steel present at death from 5 High Street, Castleford.

Ok I also have Emily Dickinson's birth (although this info may be of more interest to Jan if he is around!). It was the 3 Dec 1870 in Allerton Bywater). Informant, Father James Dickinson, a glass blower. Mother Sarah Dickinson formerly Brunyard.

Going for some lunch :D

Diane Grant-Salmon
12-09-2008, 5:00 PM
Hi Carla :)

Many thanks for all the dates and information ...... although I avoid buying death certificates at all, if I possibly can, as I get too upset about the cause of death.|sad1|

Luckily, I've only ever had to buy one, when I was really stuck on something. This applies to my direct lines too, so unless I already knew the date ...... I'm quite content to know the 3 month period and year from the death indexes!

No, I didn't know that Amelia was formerly NAYLOR, so that was a surprise. :)

Funnily enough, my Dad was born in Castleford and his parents were married there too. I only went once when I was little, to visit Gt. Uncle Arthur ....... who turned out to be Samuel Arthur!