GERTRUDE GAUNTLETT nee ASHTON

[pauline clark]

Hi i am looking for gertrude gauntlett born about 1875 died in 1965 in hounslow lived in islington hounslow holloway her mother was Hetty Tillet ? can anyone help thanks pauline

[Kerrywood]

Can you please give us a bit more? If you can tell us exactly where your information comes from, it might help members to search in appropriate places.

[Raffaele]

There are a lot of possible Gertrude Ashton births but I cannot find an Ashton/Gauntlett marriage.

There is a Gauntlett/Gertrude Cameron marriage in West Ham. Could she have married previously.

As Kerrywood says, if you can add some more detail it will help

[Mutley]

Was Gertrude a Tillet before she became an Ashton or did Hetty marry the Ashton?
Was Hetty short for another name, I cannot see a Gertrude anybody with a mother Hetty.
:confused5:

Do you have her death certificate?

[valg]

Hi i am looking for gertrude gauntlett born about 1875 died in 1965 in hounslow lived in islington hounslow holloway her mother was Hetty Tillet ? can anyone help thanks pauline

Hetty can be a short versiuon of Henrietta ...

There is a Gertrude Tillett brn Wandsworth Sept 1876

[valg]

There are a lot of possible Gertrude Ashton births but I cannot find an Ashton/Gauntlett marriage.

There is a Gauntlett/Gertrude Cameron marriage in West Ham. Could she have married previously.

As Kerrywood says, if you can add some more detail it will help

There is a Gertrude Gauntlett( 1875) married living with parents "Camerons" 1911 in WEst Ham.

[Raffaele]

Births Jun 1874
Cameron Gertrude W. Ham 4a 80

Marriages Sep 1899
Cameron Gertrude W. Ham 4a 663
Gauntlett Alfred Theckstone W. Ham 4a 663

She is on the 1901 and 1911 census in West Ham

All makes sense and looks good but

Lived Islington - could be after 1911 and West Ham is not light years from Islington
Nee Ashton - What is the source of this information
Mothers name is Hetty Tillet - according to 1881 census her mother was Margaret

I think that this Gertrude is the wrong one - but I did find this on LDS 1881 census

Anna SERVANT, Head, U, 41, Ireland, Income From Houses
Louisa SERVANT, Sister, U, 30, Ireland, Income From Houses
Emily ASHTON, Sister, M, 36, Ireland
Emily ASHTON, Niece, U, 9, East Indies
Gertrude ASHTON, Niece, U, 4, Brixton, Surrey
Ada HOLDEN, Serv, U, 18, Paddington, Middlesex, Nursemaid Dom Serv

21 Alexandra Gdns, Folkestone, Kent, England
RG11 1009 / 122 / 50

[Raffaele]

Births Jun 1876
Ashton Gertrude Lloyd Lambeth 1d 528

FMP have a Gertrude Ashton living with a Hetty Ashton in Prestwich, Manchester in 1891 and 1901
Household ASHTON, Gertrude 1878 13 F Prestwich Lancashire

[Raffaele]

Forget the Gertrude Ashton from Prestwich I found her in 1881 and Hetty is her sister.

[pauline clark]

Hi this one sounds interesting ive heard the name cameron as well thanks

[pauline clark]

Hi i dont have much info only she may have been an ashton and her mother may have been hetty tillet i dont have any certificates yet thanks

[pauline clark]

Hi yes i think this is they all seem to come from west ham etc her husband was a f gauntlett ive only heard the name hetty in passing. she is supposed to be mother of shirley farrer my first search which i did find earlier thanks pauline

[Coromandel]

she is supposed to be mother of shirley farrer

In your earlier thread about Shirley (http://www.british-genealogy.com/forums/showthread.php/69753-shirley-farrer) there is mention of the name Ashton. Where has the information on the Gauntletts come from, Pauline? Is it possible that they were foster parents?

[Raffaele]

This is the family in 1881 coutesy of the LDS

William D. CAMERON, Head, 41 Hoxton, Middlesex, Mariner Master
Margt. B. CAMERON, Wife, 41 St Lukes, Middlesex
Wm.H. CAMERON, Son, 17, Homerton, Middlesex, Articled Law Stationer
Elizth. G. CAMERON, Dau, 16, Hackney Wick, Middlesex
Archd.W. CAMERON, Son,12, Bow, Middlesex, Scholar
Annie CAMERON, Dau, 8, West Ham, Essex, Scholar
Gertrude CAMERON, Dau, 6, West Ham, Essex, Scholar
Trevor L. CAMERON, Son, 3, West Ham, Essex, Scholar
Mary H. MAJOR, Lodger, 53, Stepney, Middlesex

54 Argyle Terr Margery Pk Rd, West Ham, Essex
RG11 1721 / 95 / 39

[olliecat]

Hi i am looking for gertrude gauntlett born about 1875 died in 1965 in hounslow lived in islington hounslow holloway her mother was Hetty Tillet ? can anyone help thanks pauline

I think this census is interesting...

1901: RG13; Piece: 1566; Folio: 116; Page: 20 (crown copyright, care of the TNA)
West Ham, Essex
TILLETT Hetty 36, marr, head, Huntingdon
ASHTON William 15, son, drapers assistant, Leyton, Essex
ASHTON Gertrude 13, dau, Leyton
TILLETT Dorothy 3, dau, Stratford, Essex
VOWLES Cecil 17, boarder, Stratford

Although Gertrude's birth date does not tie in with that death. I haven't checked the later census yet.

[Thomasin]

This seems to be the family in 1891:

William H ASHTON 31 Carpenter & Joiner b. Holloway, London
Harriet ASHTON 28 b. Needingworth, Huntingdonshire
William ASHTON 5 b. West Ham
Gertrude ASHTON 3 b. West Ham
Phyllis ASHTON 1 b. West Ham
plus 2 boarders

4 Ashlin Road, West Ham, Stratford
RG12; 1314; 85; 57 courtesy of TNA.

[Coromandel]

Great find, olliecat!

This looks like Hetty ten years earlier with previous husband:

William H. Ashton, head, m., 31, carpenter & joiner, b. London Holloway
Harriett do, wife, m, 28, b. Hunts Nedingworth
William do, son, 5, b. West Ham Stratford
Gertrude do, daur, 3, b. do do
Phyllis do, do, 1, b. do do
Samuel Adderley, boarder, s, 31, carriage trimmer, b. Warwick Oldsbury

at 4 Ashlin(?) Ter., Stratford (West Ham district) in 1891
RG 12/1314, f.85 (census returns held by TNA, Crown copyright)

P.S. well done Thomasin too, you beat me to it!:)
P.P.S. I missed out details of the second boarder, Thomas Morris (railway carriage builder)

[Thomasin]

There's a marriage of William H Ashton and Harriet TIBBITT, June quarter 1884, West Ham, 4a 78.

[olliecat]

There's a marriage of William H Ashton and Harriet TIBBITT, June quarter 1884, West Ham, 4a 78.

Further details of this marriage from family search ...

groom's name: William Henry Ashton
groom's birth date: 1860
groom's age: 24
bride's name: Harriett Tibbitt
bride's birth date: 1863
bride's age: 21
marriage date: 14 Apr 1884
marriage place: St. John Baptists Church, Leytonstone, Essex, England
groom's father's name: William James Ashton
bride's father's name: William Tibbitt

I also came across this christening record (child born before the above marriage) and have been trying to figure out if it is related...

name: Leonard Stanley Ashdown
baptism/christening date: 1884
baptism/christening place: Leytonstone, St. John Baptist Church, Essex
birth date: 1882
father's name: William Ashdown
mother's name: Harriet

Edit: There is a Harriet R TIBBET working as a domestice servant in the 1881 census in West Ham. Born abt 1862 in Huntingdon.

1881: RG11 Piece: 1719 Folio: 82 Page: 45 (crown copyright, care of the TNA)

[pauline clark]

Hi ashton-steele is on shirleys marrages to melson and farrer other than that im not sure . the gauntlet came from a distat relative on the other side of this family so its only what he can remember as hes in his eightys now

[pauline clark]

Hi this address has come up on shirleys marraige cert only its no 26 ??????

[olliecat]

Hi this address has come up on shirleys marraige cert only its no 26 ??????

Sorry but which address are you referring to. Do you mean the address from post #16?


Hi yes i think this is they all seem to come from west ham etc her husband was a f gauntlett ive only heard the name hetty in passing. she is supposed to be mother of shirley farrer my first search which i did find earlier thanks pauline

Just trying to sort this out in my mind but can you tell me if this is correct? From this and your previous thread you believe that Shirley FARRER alias Elsie ASHTON STEELE (born abt 1908) was the daughter of Gertrude ASHTON who was the daughter of Hetty TILLET. Also, that Gertrude may have marred an F. GAUNTLETT.

Also, how certain are you that the Gertrude GAUNTLETT who died 1965 in Hounslow was Shirley's mother?

[Mutley]

Sorry, I have tried but I am having difficulty sorting who is who on this thread.
However, I will chuck this into the pot just in case it may be useful at some point later :smile5:

The marriage of Frederick T Gauntlett is registered in the qrt Oct-Nov-Dec of 1916 at Mile End Old Town.
Spouse was Minnie Axton, might well be Ashton. Though where they fit in I don't know, children?

EDIT: The original was Axton, his father Herbert, hers James Henry and they lived in Jamaica Road, so forget that one.

[pauline clark]

HI im not certain that this was shirleys mother or that she died in 1965 age 90 I see it just as you have put it down thanks

[Coromandel]

At 4 The Green, (Romford?), Stratford in 1911:
Hetty Tillett, head, 48, married, b. Huntingdon St Ives
Gertrude Ashton, daughter, 23, single, dressmaker (working for a drapery house), b. Essex Leytonstone
Dorothy Tillett, 13, school, b. Essex Stratford
Wm. Benj. Goodson, boarder, 44, widower, fitters labourer (railway), b. Essex Gt Coggeshall
James Starling, boarder, 18, single, preventive man (H.M. Customs), b. Norfolk Kings Lynn
Kenneth Cameron, boarder, 20, single, preventive man (H.M. Customs), b. Lancashire Lancaster

The length of Hetty's marriage (15 years) and the number of children (four in total, three still alive) have been crossed out.

A lodger at the same address filled in a separate schedule: she was Rosa Morgan, 41, single, private means, b. London Whitechapel.

(RG 14/9405, ED32, SN264 and SN265; census returns held by TNA, Crown copyright)

Shirley/Elsie should also be on the 1911 census somewhere. One possibility is a 6 year old Elsie Ashton, born East Ham, who was in West Ham Union Scattered Homes, 97-128 Savage Gardens, New Beckton (RG 14/9555, ED37, SN9999, p.4, line 18)

Census returns held by TNA, Crown copyright

[Coromandel]

The 1891 and 1901 censuses point to Gertrude Ashton (daughter of Hetty Tillet) being born about 1888. Here are a couple of possibilities for her birth registration:

1. Gertrude Annie Ashton, birth registered Q1 1887, West Ham district
possibly the Gertrude A. Ashton who married Jack A. Allen, Q4 1917, West Ham district

2. Gertrude Lilian A. Ashton, birth registered Q3 1887, West Ham district
may well be the Gertrude L.A. Morgan who married Ernest A. Morgan, Q2 1918, West Ham district

I'm not sure this gets us anywhere, though: it just adds even more names to the mix.:(

[Thomasin]

Another Cameron in post 25 - and another Morgan in post 26 (as in posts 3, 6, 14 et al and 25)!!

This is a very confusing thread.

[Coromandel]

Hi this address has come up on shirleys marraige cert only its no 26 ??????

It's not clear which post you were replying to here, Pauline: could you tell us the full address given on the marriage certificate, please? Thanks.

[olliecat]

Just looking for mother Hetty after 1911. A possible death for her is this one...

JUN 1925 West Ham 4A 41
TILLETT, Harriett
Age 63

The age ties in nicely with a birth of about 1862, but can't be sure it's the right Hetty/Harriet without the certificate.


2. Gertrude Lilian A. Ashton, birth registered Q3 1887, West Ham district may well be the Gertrude L.A. Morgan who married Ernest A. Morgan, Q2 1918, West Ham district


Came across for a death for a Gertrude Lilian A MORGAN in 1969 at Southend On Sea (district). Her birth date was recorded as 12 Aug 1887. Once again, can't be sure it is the same Gertrude who married Ernest A MORGAN, and it also does not sort out if this particular Gertrude was Hetty's daughter or not.

[pauline clark]

Hi the address i was meaning was shirley :alias elsie ashton-steele 1st marrage cert 26 margery park road forest gate 30/07/1927

[olliecat]

Shirley/Elsie should also be on the 1911 census somewhere. One possibility is a 6 year old Elsie Ashton, born East Ham, who was in West Ham Union Scattered Homes, 97-128 Savage Gardens, New Beckton


In 1911, there is also a 2 year old Elsie STEELE visiting an Albert and Harriet King PEARSON at 87 Forest Lane Stratford, Essex. I think it says her birth place is Wilsdon (i.e. Willesden) and there is a birth registered in the Hendon district in 1908. But this is speculation really since we don't know where Shirley/Else was born or if she was later adopted by Gertrude.

1911: RG14/9398 SN448

[pauline clark]

Hi what was a union scatterd home in those days ??????

[olliecat]

Hi what was a union scatterd home in those days ??????

Starting from around 1906, children under care of the West Ham Guardians could be placed in scattered homes; before this date accomodation in workhouse barracks was more the norm or children could be boarded out. You will find some information on this following site.

www.
workhouses.org.uk/WestHam/

Scroll toward the bottom of the page and have a look at the section "Aldersbrook Homes and Scattered Homes."

To quote:


West Ham placed many of its poor law children is scattered homes where a group of children were looked after by a house-parent and attended local schools.

... there were also homes at Savage Gardens ...


Edit: One reason that the scattered home system was developed was to create an environment where children could better integrate into society. These children went to local schools, whereas children in workhouses or isolated homes did not.

In general, scattered homes weren't really considered appropriate for short-term children and so it is likely that this Elsie ASHTON was either an orphan or had been deserted by her parents.

[pauline clark]

Hi thanks a lot very interesting cheers pauline

[pauline clark]

This seems to be the family in 1891:

William H ASHTON 31 Carpenter & Joiner b. Holloway, London
Harriet ASHTON 28 b. Needingworth, Huntingdonshire
William ASHTON 5 b. West Ham
Gertrude ASHTON 3 b. West Ham
Phyllis ASHTON 1 b. West Ham
plus 2 boarders

4 Ashlin Road, West Ham, Stratford
RG12; 1314; 85; 57 courtesy of TNA.

Hi thanks for this it sounds interesting cheers pauline

[pauline clark]

HI still searching for gertrude gauntlett nee ashton . i have now realised i may have the wrong date could be 1888 daughter of Hetty Tillitt also1911 gertrude gauntlett nee cameron 1875 no mothers maiden names

[olliecat]

HI still searching for gertrude gauntlett nee ashton . i have now realised i may have the wrong date could be 1888 daughter of Hetty Tillitt also1911 gertrude gauntlett nee cameron 1875 no mothers maiden names

I'm wondering how we can progress with this Pauline, unless you have some more clues for us. The problem at the moment is that we don't have enough information to determine if either of these Gertrudes is the right one. To summarize...

Gertrude CAMERON born abt. 1875 in West Ham ...

Daughter of William CAMERON and Margaret Baushfield GADDSON.

Gertrude CAMERON married Alfred Theckstone GAUNTLETT in 1899. She is in the 1901 census with her husband Alfred and in the 1911 census with her parents (still married.)


Gertrude ASHTON born abt. 1888 in West Ham

Daughter of William ASHTON and Hetty/Harriet.
Gertrude is in the 1911 census with her mother Hetty TILLET.

Gertrude may have married Jack A. ALLEN in 1917 or Ernest A. MORGAN in 1918 or neither of these; we can't tell without looking at the marriage certificates. (Unless someone can find WW1 military records for Jack A. ALLEN or Ernest A. MORGAN and the records mention a wife.)



From your first post ...


Hi i am looking for gertrude gauntlett born about 1875 died in 1965 in hounslow

As an aside, the Getrude GAUNTLETT who died in 1965 in the Hounslow district was 86, thus born about 1879 rather than 1875. But disregarding the birth date issue, where did you come by this information and are you convinced you have found the correct death record? If so it may be a good idea to get hold of a copy as it may have the husband's name on the certificate

Also, do you think you can obtain any more clues about Gertrude from your distant relative?

[pauline clark]

Hi thanks for info the distant relative is away for month . Im not really sure re death in hounslow i think i will send for both certificates im also still looking for her daughter . elsie ashton -steele /melson /farrer as g gauntlett was on both marraige certs over 20 years apartas awitness but no fathers names for her

[markheal]

[list=1] Gertrude CAMERON born abt. 1875 in West Ham ...

Daughter of William CAMERON and Margaret Baushfield GADDSON.

Gertrude CAMERON married Alfred Theckstone GAUNTLETT in 1899. She is in the 1901 census with her husband Alfred and in the 1911 census with her parents (still married.)




Alfred Theckstone GAUNTLETT in NSW Australia in 1930 Electoral Roll. No sign of Gertrude but two other GAUNTLETT women in same town, Macquarie city.


Source: Ancestry.com

Florence Helen Gauntlett
Mary Jane Gauntlett
Alfred Theckstone Gauntlett