WWII Service Records

[RichardMarcJ]

My grandfather John Johnson served in World War II. He was a captain in the Royal Artillary. Is there some kind of online list of World War II servicemen? What kind of information would a service record hold? The reason why I ask is his family is the only branch of my family where I am very very stuck (my grandfather died before I was born, and his parents died when he was 5 and 14... and I can't find any information on his family). I am looking for information on his parents. If the military records don't hold it, where do you suggest I look?

[Geoffers]

My grandfather John Johnson served in World War II. He was a captain in the Royal Artillary. Is there some kind of online list of World War II servicemen?
For army service records, see the following link for details of where to apply
http://www.mod.uk/aboutus/military/records/army.htm
If he was a Captain, then you should be able to build up some idea of his service from 'The Army List' - depending where you live, you may be able to find a partial run of this publication in a large library.

I am looking for information on his parents. If the military records don't hold it, where do you suggest I look?
I assume that your grandfather has died, do you know when and where?

Have you obtained his marriage certificate yet? This will give his age and father's name and occuaption. Using this you may then hunt for his birth certificate. Are you aware of the system of civil registration anmd how to look for references and apply for certificates?

Geoffers
Charlbury, Oxfordshire

[RichardMarcJ]

Yes, my grandfather has died. He died at his home in Hemel Hempstead, Herts on 3 June 1977. He was a politician, and I have a great deal of information on his adult life. Varying from newspaper articles to testimonials from his former secretary when he was mayor of Hemel Hempstead. She still works as the mayor's secretary!

I have a copy of his birth certificate, which my grandmother (who is still alive) gave me. It says that he accessed it in 1940 (around the same time I believe he joined the army). I know the name of his parents and the years that they died. His father was a "Shipyard joiner" in Newcastle. As to when they were born or their parent's names, I have no idea.

Ideally, I would like a copy of my grandfather's parent's marriage certificate. Their first son was born in 1912. So, I can roughly say that they were married around 1910-1911. But I don't know where to go from there in order to obtain it.

I live in the United States, but the rest of my family lives in the UK. I am unfamiliar with the of civil registration anmd how to look for references and apply for certificates. I hope you could enlighten me on it? Thank you.

[johnpritt]

I've just applied for my father's military records, and am waiting for them to arrive. By coincidence, he also served in the Royal Artillery during the war.
You can apply for a copy of his record, or you can ask your grandmother to do so. If you do it, it will cost you £25 (and they don't take credit cards, so you'll probably have to get postal orders); however, if your grandmother requests them it should be free for her.

The address to contact is:
Army Personnel Centre
Historical Disclosures
Mail Point 400
Kentigern House
65 Brown Street
Glasgow G2 8EX

The phone number is +44-141-2243030 or fax +44-141-2242144.

I phoned them and gave then the details that I had (fortunately, I knew my father's regiment details and service number) and they sent me the necessary forms. Since my father died after his service ended, I also had to provide proof of his death (a copy of the death certificate). The person I spoke to was very helpful -- though I had to wait for quite a while before someone answered the phone!

Since I live outside the UK, the most complicated thing for me was to get a postal order to pay for it!

I finally got round to sending everything off last week and am now waiting for the records to be sent. On the forms I received, however, they do mention that this can take up to 6 months.

Having said that, I also requested some details for my father's younger brother, he also served in the Royal Artillery during the war.
You can apply for a copy of his record, or you can ask your grandmother to do so. If you do it, it will cost you £25 (and they don't take credit cards, so you'll probably have to get postal orders); however, if your grandmother requests them it should be free for her.


Hope this helps

[RichardMarcJ]

I understand it fine.

If I don't know his regiment, will I still be able to do this?

[Geoffers]

I live in the United States, but the rest of my family lives in the UK. I am unfamiliar with the of civil registration anmd how to look for references and apply for certificates. I hope you could enlighten me on it? Thank you.Since 1837 births, marriages and deaths (BMD) in England and Wales have been centrally registered by the General Register Office (GRO). They are able to issue copies of certificates. To help locate entries, there is an index (often referred to as the GRO index). This index was produced every 3 months. The entries for Jane, Feb and March are in the March quarter, Apr, May and June in the June quarter, etc.

A period of 6 weeks is allowed in which to register an event, so some BMD from Dec may appear in the following March; some March events may appear in June, etc.

continued....

[Geoffers]

part 2.....

There is a project to put the GRO index on a web-site with free access, this is not complete, but a useful starting point, it's UIRL is http://freebmd.rootsweb.com/cgi/search.pl

The complete GRO index is on a pay-per-view web-site 1837 online

Using references found in the GRO index, you can apply for a copy of a certificate online via http://www.gro.gov.uk/gro/content/

The reference in the GRO index basically consists of the Year, Quarter, Surname, Forename(s), Registration District, Volume and Page. This index is only of use when applying for certificates from the GRO.

If you know when and where an event took place, you may also apply for a certificate from the Local Registrar.

continued.....

[Geoffers]

part 3....

The basic information contained in a birth certificate is:
Date and Place, name, sex, father's name and surname, mother's name and maiden name, father's occupation, Informant's name, description (i.e. relationship) and address, when registered.

The basic information on a marriage certificate is:
Date and Place, whether after banns or licence, then the Groom and Bride's name, age, marital state, occupation, address, father's name and occupation. Whether they signed or made a mark, the witnesses signatures or marks.

The basic information for a death certificate is:
Date and Place, Name and Surname,sex, age, occupation, cause of death, signature, description and reisdence of informant, when registered

continued......

[Geoffers]

You first wrote.......

"My grandfather John Johnson served in World War II.....and I can't find any information on his family). I am looking for information on his parents."

and then........

"I have a copy of his birth certificate, which my grandmother (who is still alive) gave me. It says that he accessed it in 1940 (around the same time I believe he joined the army). I know the name of his parents and the years that they died. His father was a "Shipyard joiner" in Newcastle. As to when they were born or their parent's names, I have no idea"

So, I assume that he was born around 1920-ish and from the birth certificate, you have his parents name and motehr's maiden name.

Now, unless you know of earlier children - or have someother information to narrow down the time period, search the GRO index of marriages - starting with the quarter in which your grandad was born and work back in time.

Your grandad's birth certificate may just show one forename each for his mum and dad - but they may have had more than one forename each. So search all entries for the surname. When you find an entry which may fit under the groom's name, note down the full entry. Then check the same quarter under the bride's name if it is a match, it should show the same district, volume and page.

continued......

[Geoffers]

When you get the marriage certificate for your gt-grandparents, it should show their ages and fathers' names and occupations. You may then be at a stage that you might be able to identify them on the 1901 census. This can be seen online (index free to search, pay to view the image)

and so you keep working back in time, using the GRO records and census returns. Archive CD Books sell many censuses on CD-rom and also directories, in which your family may be found.

That's the very basics, there's loads more. I think you should get used to looking for and applying for certificates and using the 1901 census - then come back and ask more questions, if needed. A good book or one of the many magazines available would help you to understand the first steps to researching a family history. You'll also find some 'how to' guides on http://www.british-genealogy.com/

Geoffers
Charlbury, Oxfordshire

[johnpritt]

I understand it fine.

If I don't know his regiment, will I still be able to do this?

Yes, give as much information as you can. You already know he was in the Royal Artillery, which is a start. I was lucky as I had a copy of my Dad's discharge paper with his service number and regiment. The more info you can give them, the easier it will be for them to identify your grandfather. I'm lucky in having a fairly rare surname -- John Johnson is maybe not quite so rare but you also know his date of birth, so that will help tie things down.

I should have added in my first post that I phoned them forst just to check the procedures and what documents they might need from me. They noted down all the information I had on my Dad during the phone call, then posted me the application forms.

[RichardMarcJ]

So, I assume that he was born around 1920-ish and from the birth certificate, you have his parents name and motehr's maiden name.


He was born on 11 March 1913. His oldest brother was born in 1912.

This is all really good information, and I will now try it all out. I found a little biography that my grandfather wrote about himself the year before he died. He says that he entered the army from 1940-1946, and his official "rank on demobilisation: Captain RA"

Thanks again for the useful information