Help needed deciphering name

[mary elms]

Can anyone work out the name on this Carbrooke marriage certificate? It's the only chance I'll ever get to find out who the bride thinks her father is as there are no father's details on her birth certificate and she uses her mother's surname on all official documents. |banghead|

http://myweb.tiscali.co.uk/elmtree/

Thanks in advance for any thoughts you might have,

Mary.

[Peggy]

Hi Mary,

Cory Richards????

Do you have more samples of the same handwriting?

Peggy

[mary elms]

Thanks Peggy.

I (or rather my digitally-minded husband (they do have their uses :D )) have replaced the image with a bigger sample. You might need to refresh the page to see it.

http://myweb.tiscali.co.uk/elmtree/

Cory was my guess too.

Mary.

[Rod Neep]

The important question for verification is WHEN?

It will then be very easy indeed to look up the name in a Norfolk county directory! (I have them all here at work, and therefore I could look it up very easily for you)

A farmer will certainly show up in the directories :)

Regards
Rod

ps. and for what its worth, my fist impression is that it looks like EDWARDS rather than RICHARDS

[mary elms]

Thanks Rod,

The marriage was in 1863 (after she, too, had 3 'fatherless' children!) and she was born in 1840.

Mary.

[Peggy]

Hi Mary,

No other "C" has that little loop at the bottom. A "G" maybe?? Gary? Are you satisfied with Richards? Be nice to see that under a magnifier. The "ards" part looks fairly clear, but the beginning doesn't.

Tried an Ancestry search of all UK census years, got no Cory Richards except one Corry, a girl, and a couple of Richardsons.

Peggy

P. S. Just saw Rod's post, so I guess you'll soon get your answer. "Edwards" was my 2nd choice. :)

[mary elms]

Edwards does look a good bet doesn't it, Peggy, though Richards was a possible. You've both managed to come up with something on the surname where I drew a complete blank! :)

Everything else on the page is totally legible ...... what's that thing about legibility being inversely proportional to the urgency of the need........?

Mary.

[Geoffers]

Everything else on the page is totally legible ...... what's that thing about legibility being inversely proportional to the urgency of the need........?Mary.
It's Cory EDWARDS. Why not post the other bits you are having problems with?

Geoffers

[Peggy]

Hi Geoffers,

Guess I'll never get good enough at this to be that sure about reading it. Even when I see the right possiblity, I reject it. :(

I don't think that Mary has problems with other bits, as she said the rest is legible.

Hi Mary,

Spotted an 1849 marriage for an Edward Cory Edwards in Norfolk. Maybe your man finally taking the plunge?

Peggy

[mary elms]

Thanks Geoffers, this is the only bit I can't read. I've just been looking at FreeBMD and I see that there's a marriage in 1849 for an Edward Cory Edwards in Swaffham. Now if he turns out to be a farmer - either then or at a later date - and if he doesn't turn out to be 9yrs old in 1840, then I'd say that he's beginning to look like a very good bet.

Mary.


If my name were Edward Edwards I think I'd use my 2nd name!!!!

EDIT - Just read your reply Peggy - we were obviously following the same thought!

[Jo Simpsons]

Theres also a death on freebmd for Cory Edward Edwards in 1851 in Wayland, thats also where the marriage to Joseph and Fanny show?

Just a thought.
Jo :)

[mary elms]

Theres also a death on freebmd for Cory Edward Edwards in 1851 in Wayland
Jo :)

If he is the right man then it might explain why Fanny felt she could name him on her marriage certificate!

Mary,

[Rod Neep]

OK... browsing though the directory EDWARDS who are farmers who might fit the bill in the 1864 Norfolk Whites Directory

Edward EDWARDS at Tuddenham

But no mention of Cory EDWARDS

Clutching at straws in the search..
Edward CORY Mangate Street, Swaffham
There seem to be rather a lot of CORY people in Norfolk

1879 Norfolk directory (he should still be alive)... shows no RICHARDS as farmers

But these are the EDWARDS who are farmers.
http://www.british-genealogy.com/acdb/odds/nfk1879farmers.jpg

No sign of a Cory :-(
% in the search..</FONT></FONT></FONT></P>Edward CORY Mangate Street, Swaffham
There seem to be rather a lot of CORY people in Norfolk

1879 Norfolk directory (he should still be alive)... shows no RICHARDS as farmers

But these are the EDWARDS who are farmers.
http://www.british-genealogy.com/acdb/odds/nfk1879farmers.jpg

No sign of a Cory :-(

[mary elms]

Thanks Rod,

though that sounds like bad news it may not be. :) It actually reinforces the feeling that Edward Cory Edwards married 1849, & Cory Edward Edwards died 1851 may be the person I'm looking for.

The question that isn't answered on these earlier death indexes is his age. He could still wind up being too young to have fathered Fanny in 1840. :(

Mary.

[mary elms]

Geoffers,

What percentage of the 1841 census is now on the Norfolk Transcription Archive?

(By the way - it's grown a huge amount since I last looked |cheers| to everyone who's contributed!)

At the moment there's only one Edward Edward(s) on it and he's a tailor in Great Yarmouth (doesn't seem very likely somehow) and no Cory Edwards.

I have a long list of census lookups and trawls for my next visit to the FRC (whenever that will be). The question is do I put this one on it?

Mary.

[Geoffers]

What percentage of the 1841 census is now on the Norfolk Transcription Archive?'Tis only a small percentage. A couple of years ago, I created a surname index to about 120 places in the 1841 Norfolk census and posted these on the rootsweb mailing list - in a similar way that I've been doing with the 1861 census on these forums.


I have a long list of census lookups and trawls for my next visit to the FRC (whenever that will be). The question is do I put this one on it?The 1841 census is of course available from Archive CD Books. You can buy single CDs covering just part of the county, rather than the whole set - this can be useful if you are only interested in part of the county.

Geoffers

[mary elms]

'Tis only a small percentage. A couple of years ago, I created a surname index to about 120 places in the 1841 Norfolk census and posted these on the rootsweb mailing list - in a similar way that I've been doing with the 1861 census on these forums.

Thanks I'd forgotten about that - I'll have a look!


The 1841 census is of course available from Archive CD Books. You can buy signle CDs covering just part of teh county, rather than the whole set - this can be useful if you are only interested in part of the county.


I agree! Sadly, until there's a wage-earner in the house again even that's not possible! :( It's a matter of prioritizing costs. :(

However, enough of my sob story ;)

Thanks again to everyone and I'll post an update when I find out more.

|cheers|

Mary.

[mary elms]

thats also where the marriage to Joseph and Fanny show?

Jo :)

Hello Jo,

Just received my e-mail for this thread and noticed your other bit of detective work for the first time :cool:

Yes that is the marriage on the certificate!

Mary.

[mary elms]

I've just spent a fruitful day at the Family Records Centre

And I found Cory Edwards - twice! |woohoo|

1841 Griston, Norfolk

Robert Edwards 65 Farmer Yes
Charlotte Edwards 26 Dressmaker Yes
Sarah Edwards 22 Yes
Cory Edwards 20 Farmer Yes

1851 Wotton Road, Griston, Norfolk

Coree Edwards head M 33 Farmer Griston
Mary Ann Edwards wife M 31 Griston
Charlotte Edwards daur 1 Griston
Mary Edwards daur 2 Griston
Anne Martha do? serv U 16 Carbrooke


This makes him the right sort of age to have fathered Fanny in 1840.

I'm beginning to be reasonably confident that this is who Fanny believed her father to be.

The next question is - Did he leave a will? Never needed to look for one of those before - no one's ever had anything to leave :D

And is he the Edward Cory Edwards who married in Swaffham in 1849 and the Cory Edward Edwards whose death was registered in Wayland in the Sept Q of 1851?

And if I'm curious enough - which I almost certainly am - Who had the farm in 1861?

Thanks so much for all your help |cheers|

Mary.

[Geoffers]

I've just spent a fruitful day at the Family Records Centre
And I found Cory Edwards - twice!.......1851 Wotton Road, Griston, Norfolk
I think that should be Watton Road. I've had a quick scan of Griston 1861 and no trace of any EDWARDS in the parish then.


The next question is - Did he leave a will? Never needed to look for one of those before - no one's ever had anything to leave
Good thinking, if he died prior to 1851 and he left one, it is likely that the will is held by Norfolk Records Office.


And is he the Edward Cory Edwards who married in Swaffham in 1849
Could well be, have you tried searching freebmd and clicking on the page number? One of the two brides on this page is conveniently recorded as Mary Ann WARMAN.

Geoffers

[mary elms]

I think that should be Watton Road.

What can I say, Geoffers, the 'a' and the 'o' buttons aren't even next to each other |blush|

No, I hadn't looked at the other names on the page yet. The marriage certainly looks promising!

1861 - that's interesting. I wonder where the family went? If Cory Edwards died in 1851, just over 2 years after getting married and leaving his wife with 2 small girls, perhaps she re-married.

Thanks for the pointer about where to look for a will.

Mary.

[mary elms]

Boy have this lot led me a merry dance!!!! Just for completeness sake and in case it's ever relevant to someone else ...........

1st generation
Mary Ann TOLMAN (born around 1800) married Wright HARVEY in Carbrooke in 1826
She already had two children - Susan TOLMAN (baptized 1819) and Mary Ann TOLMAN (baptized 1821) These two children became part of the HARVEY family & used the HARVEY name.

2nd generation
Mary Ann HARVEY appears to have had a relationship with Cory EDWARDS a farmer from Griston just down the road from Carbrooke. She had two children by this relationship - Fanny Christiana HARVEY (born & baptized 1840) and Charles Edwards HARVEY (born 1843)

Mary Ann HARVEY died in 1846. Her death was registered as Mary TOLMAN and she was buried in Carbrooke as Mary TOLMAN (no wonder I couldn't find her!)

Cory EDWARDS appears to have married Mary Ann WARMAN in 1849. (I haven't checked) They had two children before he died in 1851.

3rd generation
Fanny Christiana HARVEY & Charles Edwards HARVEY grew up with their grandparents Wright & Mary Ann HARVEY. And there begins yet another really convoluted tale ....... It was Fanny's marriage certificate which started this thread rolling.

Mary.

PS - Sorry I haven't got Myth's way with words!