Cost of certificates to rise in April

[Sue Mackay]

Get your orders for certificates in now. The cost will rise from £7 to £9:50 in April, seemingly with or without GRO reference number.

http://www.ips.gov.uk/cps/rde/xchg/ips_live/hs.xsl/1569.htm

Edit: Correction - make that £9:25

[Jan1954]

Yikes! :yikes: That is one heck of a price hike!

Thank you for bringing this to our attention, Sue.

[sueannbowen]

Get your orders for certificates in now. The cost will rise from £7 to £9:50 in April, seemingly with or without GRO reference number.

http://www.ips.gov.uk/cps/rde/xchg/ips_live/hs.xsl/1569.htm

For goodness sake! Whatever happened to consultation??:frown2:

[swheather]

I thought they were going up to £9.25 but still bad enough, think it is from 6th April

[busyglen]

Thank you very much Sue.

I've been putting off getting a couple as I wasn't too sure about them, but I think I'll take a chance. I'd rather lose £7 than £9.50.

Glenys

[pennydog]

Get your orders for certificates in now. The cost will rise from £7 to £9:50 in April, seemingly with or without GRO reference number.

http://www.ips.gov.uk/cps/rde/xchg/ips_live/hs.xsl/1569.htm

:nonod:Well even though I know the reference number, be blowed if I will tell them, let them earn the extra £2.50|rant|

[Jane Gee]

Hi
I have just been notified of this grr what a price hike staff wont be getting the money I can tell you!!!!! So how can they justify such a big jump.
Best Wishes
Jane

[Mitch in Notts]

pennydog said:

Well even though I know the reference number, be blowed if I will tell them, let them earn the extra £2.50

In which case you could be in for quite a wait!

GRO:
Standard - despatch on the fourth working day from receipt of order, or the fifteenth working day when no reference number is quoted

[pennydog]

Darn it!!!!! they get you every way.

[v.wells]

Double the http://bestsmileys.com/scared/5.gif. I wonder if I'll be able to collect any money back when I get "beyond"? I better get busy choosing the urgent ones I need.

Thanks for the information Sue!

[Sue Mackay]

I thought they were going up to £9.25 but still bad enough, think it is from 6th April

Apologies, it is £9:25 and not £9:50. My lousy copying skills. See, I give you bad news and then soften the blow |laugh1|

[Pam Downes]

Another 'thank you Sue' from me. |hug|

Last year I made a list of the certificates that I 'must have' and had a fit when they came to over two thousand quid. :yikes: Fortunately I found out that I'd put the decimal point in the wrong place :biggrin5: |dunce2|, but even so I ain't going to pay that price increase on the ones I want.
Just hope hubby doesn't want feeding for the rest of the month, because I have plans for the housekeeping. :biggrin5:
Now, what's my ONS password, and (even more difficult to remember) - in which pile of papers is that 'list of certificates wanted'? :biggrin5: (Or would it be quicker to make a new one?)
Pam

[v.wells]

I have just gone thru my list and I have 11 must haves :yikes:
I don't know if I can truly whittle it down - and that's out of a pile of 30+ !! I still have Wills to get too :cryin:

[Ladkyis]

This is the first change to the pricing since 2003 and while it took my breath away we have to remember that it is a government department and it has just realised that this coyld be a nice little earner

Perhaps we should be pestering our MPs to ask for a two tier system where we can buy photocopies that are not on the legal certificates for half the price - they can do it in Ireland why not here?

[Jane Gee]

:devil:Having just posted my search via the NHS for my grandma in 1939 £42.00 and my brother is going halves with me I cant think of another excuse to start spending money this month on n certificates. I bought 2 last month and an upgrade for my FTM so no clothes shopping for a bit!
Jane

[Copper]

I must dig out my list of certificate wants. I know that I would like (not the same as need) 4 death certificates. I have been toying with buying some certificates for my Stringle branch but as they are not for direct ancestors I have been putting them off.

[Chris01]

Thanks for letting us know Sue!

[SBSFamilyhistory]

now that is beyond belief....thanks Sue for letting us know. I wonder have they can justify such a big increase in price.

Sue

[Chris01]

Strangely a small difference of 25p less from local offices it seems, if I have read it correctly...

[cristol]

thanks for letting us know Sue, I have been dithering over a couple for a while now this might get me moving. Another lean time in the Cristol household this month - might have to have a blitz and then rely on red cross food parcels from the rest of the family !
Lesley

[Pam101]

Thanks, Sue. I too will be reviewing certificates I want and getting my order in. A 32% price hike is extortionate - they could have phased it in and softened the blow a bit. Guess there may be a bit of a backlog soon:frown:

[AnnB]

Thanks for the warning Sue - thank goodness I think I have got all the 'must haves' I need.

There will have to be a very good reason for me to get any certificates when the price zooms up.........although, I suspect, I'll change my mind when I find a 'must have' I should have got and haven't :lol:

Best wishes
Ann

[Ladkyis]

they could have phased it in and softened the blow a bit.

I think some people would have shouted loudly if they had made a smaller increase now and the another next year. Lets face it we are never going to be happy with having to pay more for anything are we? I will certainly always complain about prices going up but as I said previously this is the fist price hike since 2003 so we have done well up to now.

[Mona]

When I first started this family malarkey!, some 10 years ago, the certificates were £8.50. I had to fax or mail the request as on-line ordering had not yet begun. They were reduced to £7, when that happened. So I don't think it is too bad.
At the time I lived in Canada and at an exchange of 2.50 to the pound it was YIKES! The present exchange rate is 1.58. So all us foreigners just love the weak pound!!
As Ladykis states, why don't they just provide a photocopy and not a certified one?

[louisa maud]

Thanks Sue. It takes all the fun oiut of the pleasure when they up the price so much in one go.

Louisa Maud

[Shezzy]

I had heard that it was going up to £9.25 from the GRO, but if you ordered form the local register office it would only be £9.00 - every 25p helps

the details are at
http://www.ips.gov.uk/cps/rde/xchg/ips_live/hs.xsl/1569.htm

Shezzy

[pattenwalsh]

Well fellow Genealogists,please send a letter to your local MP,as I intend to do, tomorrow ponting out that a 32 % rise is a complete nonsense as we are told that inflation is currently running at 3%.
My MP is,luckily, a very good one who will listen to the people he represents and always writes back with his findings and action that he has taken.Whilst he is not of the political party that I would normally vote for he none the less will get my vote come the Election!

[v.wells]

I went crazy on Monday and ordered 8 which turned out to be a good deal because of the low pound exchange rate :)

[Guy Etchells]

Well fellow Genealogists,please send a letter to your local MP,as I intend to do, tomorrow ponting out that a 32 % rise is a complete nonsense as we are told that inflation is currently running at 3%.
My MP is,luckily, a very good one who will listen to the people he represents and always writes back with his findings and action that he has taken.Whilst he is not of the political party that I would normally vote for he none the less will get my vote come the Election!

Except that over the seven years since the last price rise inflation was far higher.
The new price is very much in line with inflation and in fact if they put their minds to it the government could easily justify a jump up to around £10 to £12.
Cheers
Guy

[trotters]

Here Here !!!...lol

[pattenwalsh]

The letter goes tomorrow and reads as follows.....".Re; Forthcoming price increase for copies of Birth,Marriage and Death certificates from the Government Records Office.

As an amateur genealogist,who started the hobby after watching programmes such as “Who do you think you are?”and “Heirhunters”,I am not impressed by price rises that are due to come into effect from this coming April.
Copies of certificates that are vital to the true establishment of a family’s past are being put beyond the reach of ordinary people who are just curious about their past.
These certificates currently cost £7 each,which when you consider that you can obtain PHOTOCOPIES of Irish records (should you have Irish in your family ) for 6 Euro (about £5.45) are already excessive.
However to raise the cost of UK copies of Birth,Marriage and Death certificates to the astronomical price of £9.25,some 32%! ,is totally unjustifiable in the light of today’s current economic situation and I think as more people have started to see this as a new hobby it has been leapt upon as an easy way to raise revenue.
I would hope that yourself,as my local ,and well respected M.P will pass on my concerns to those that matter.
Thanking You,"

[Peter Goodey]

we are told that inflation is currently running at 3%.

I'm afraid that's beside the point. It's inflation from 2003 to 2010 that's relevant. This figure can easily be found online.

[Devonmade]

Remember that the cost of postage has risen in the period 2003 - 2010 and that all taxpayers in the UK have been subsidising those of us who have purchased certificates from the GRO.

[markmorgan]

It would be nice if they would differentiate between historical certificates and current live certificates and charged half price for ones that cover events over 70-years ago for instance.

Perhaps put the price up furher on 'current' ones and down on historic ones.

I orderered two myself a couple of week's ago so I'll have to come up wth a hit-list of some more to get before the price change.

Mark.

[shazzababe2361]

I have to say i went to Leeds RO to get a certificate that i needed and was in shock because i asked for it in person and didnt order it they charged my a wopping eye watering £15.00 i did pay cause i was embarrased not to............i will never do that again without calling first to see how much it will cost to collect in person.

[benny1982]

I am ordering as many certs as I can which are really relevant before the price increases but I shall still order the odd one afterwards. But not as many as I do now. I ordered 5 certs 2 weeks ago and ordered 4 certs 2 days ago.

[Erlang]

I'll have to have a little spree before the price rise, but I to wish we could get a "Genealogy-cert" less official and cheaper.

On a side note are the certificates already digitised or is each request a fresh search for originals and then a digital copy made.?
Also if the latter is the opportunity taken to digitise the cert for the future?

[Guy Etchells]

I have to say i went to Leeds RO to get a certificate that i needed and was in shock because i asked for it in person and didnt order it they charged my a wopping eye watering £15.00 i did pay cause i was embarrased not to............i will never do that again without calling first to see how much it will cost to collect in person.

You should have refused, they cannot legally charge more than the statutory fee.
Cheers
Guy

[Wirral]

This is the first change to the pricing since 2003 and while it took my breath away we have to remember that it is a government department and it has just realised that this coyld be a nice little earner



now that is beyond belief....thanks Sue for letting us know. I wonder have they can justify such a big increase in price.

Sue

The statutory charges for certificates from both the GRO & the LROs are set by the Registrar General. Briefly, the Registrar General sets the charges by calculating the cost of providing that service versus the price charged for the certificates. They are not allowed to make a profit from this, nor is the money raised supposed to cross-subsidise other government departments (either national or local).

[Peter Goodey]

I think that what Wirral says is correct except that the charges are actually laid down in an order (statutory instrument) made by the Secretary of State and laid before parliament who can reject it (at least in theory).

You can read this SI (The Registration of Births, Deaths and Marriages (Fees) Order 2010) on the Statute Law database.

[Wirral]

I think that what Wirral says is correct except that the charges are actually laid down in an order (statutory instrument) made by the Secretary of State and laid before parliament who can reject it (at least in theory).

Thanks Peter, I was trying to keep it as non-technical as possible. It's the Registrar General who pulls together all the information on the costs (from both the GRO & all the LROs) & comes up with the figure that is then laid before Parliament to approve.

The cost to the local authority of providing the service will vary from one LRO to another, but they all have to charge the same fee for the basic service, ie producing a certificate. Some LROs charge an additional fee, eg to get a certificate within an hour at Liverpool RO costs £25 (£7 for the certificate + £18 for a "General Search"). Other LROs will charge just £7 for a certificate that you can pick up that day. Or they may charge for postage. Whether these additional charges have any legal justification is debatable.

[Betsie]

The ONS makes a fortune out of genealogists, the tax payer does not subsidise us. A rise of 32% is ridiculus. The solution is easy, every one should stop buying certificates, they will soon realise they have made a mistake and re appraise the situation. Most of their work is for us. Why should the price be the same when you provide a reference and have done most of the work for them? People power got rid of Thatcher's Poll Tax, we can do the same here.

[Peter Goodey]

the tax payer does not subsidise us

Eh? What's the admission fee to the National Archives and to County Record Offices?

[Colin Rowledge]

I see this thread becoming 'political" -- or is it me? While I may resent the increase, in Canada anyway, it is still the most reasonably priced and time efficient service available.

This is a hobby and something I enjoy [apart from frustations noted in some earlier threads]. I have learned a lot [and spent a lot] and hopefully I will have all the BMD's I need before the price increase - but if not -- why sweat the small stuff? If a hobby becomes too expensive you have a choice available.

Colin

PS I'm not wealthy, on a fixed income -i.e. retired - butt the idea of not having such a service avaiable is abhorent to me

[Guy Etchells]

The ONS makes a fortune out of genealogists, the tax payer does not subsidise us. A rise of 32% is ridiculus. The solution is easy, every one should stop buying certificates, they will soon realise they have made a mistake and re appraise the situation. Most of their work is for us. Why should the price be the same when you provide a reference and have done most of the work for them? People power got rid of Thatcher's Poll Tax, we can do the same here.

Sorry but the facts do not show that.

The GRO had an income of £18,733,000 for the year 2008-2009. They had operating costs amounting to £25,360,000 which means they made a loss or had a deficit of £6,627,000.
That £6,627,000 has been funded by the taxpayer.

Cheers
Guy

[Mitch in Notts]

Well I`ve just price checked the cost of buying a New Zealand Marriage Certificate. $26NZ. Which according to Google conversion rate is about £12.
Much more expensive than here. I`m having a blitz and buying the next 6 months worth of certificates now at £7 . And then forgoing any till Christmas!

It would make more sense, in my opinion, to have put the price up by say 50p each year, rather than a big leap. It is the big leap that is causing all the furore.

Mitch

[Betsie]

I am only talking about certificates, not admission charges to Record Offices etc., that is a different matter.
The ONS does other work besides writing certificates, I still maintain we are not being subsidised, work it out, how many certificates do you think they can do in an hour, when they have the reference? I would estimate 6 easily. 6 x £7 is £42, I know the staff don't earn that, I also know there are running costs for the buildings etc, but, if they never write another certificate out again, these buildings will still have to be maintained. The new charges will mean at the rate of 6 certificates an hour they will make £55.50 from these sales alone, that is not including the charges for special delivery. How can anyone say the cost of certificates is subsidised by the tax payer !!
I don't advocate a permanent boycot, but just one long enough to show them they need us. I know hobbies can be expensive, and I would expect to pay a fair price, but I don't consider £9.25 to be fair. Certificates without a reference are £8.50, so a rise of 75p is reasonable, but, a rise of £2.25 is not reasonable. I'd see no point finding references, which would mean staff would spend longer doing the certificates. Some people would not purchase them at this price, or at least buy less, so in the long run the ONS could come unstuck.

[v.wells]

You can always stop buying from GRO alttogether and purchase from a ppv site which will cost nearly triple the amount! If the governments don't make a profit somewhere, all these departments will face huge budget cuts and possibly put lots of people out of work. I have no problem paying for certificates from the GRO or local offices for without them I would have no proof of factual events. If people don't purchase certificates that is their choice and their loss of factual historical evidence which is the one thing that separates the true family historian and the faint-hearted hobbyist.

[Pam Downes]

You can always stop buying from GRO alttogether and purchase from a ppv site which will cost nearly triple the amount! If the governments don't make a profit somewhere, all these departments will face huge budget cuts and possibly put lots of people out of work. I have no problem paying for certificates from the GRO or local offices for without them I would have no proof of factual events. If people don't purchase certificates that is their choice and their loss of factual historical evidence which is the one thing that separates the true family historian and the faint-hearted hobbyist.
And all that means is that the ppv site will make a massive amount of money for buying from the GRO on your behalf. Because the GRO is where the ppv sites obtain their certificates from. :smile5:
To continue Vanessa's thoughts - it all depends on what infomation you want about your ancestors, and how accurate you want that information to be. And can you access that information by other means - and at what cost? I've found what I think is a marriage for my great grandfather's sister. Not imperative that I have proof that it's her, but on the other hand it would be nice to know, especially as she moved away from home. So I can either order in at my local LDS FHC a film of the PRs for the main church in the registration district, plus spend my time, and money on petrol, going to view the film and hope to goodness she married in that parish. Or I can pay seven quid for the marriage certificate. (And I think that even at £9.25 I'd probably still be in profit!)
So, yes, I will gulp when I have to cough up the increased charge, but I'm sensible enough to recognise that if I want all the informatrion that the BMD certificates have that I'm going to have to pay to access it.
Pam

[Guy Etchells]

I am only talking about certificates, not admission charges to Record Offices etc., that is a different matter.
The ONS does other work besides writing certificates, I still maintain we are not being subsidised, work it out, how many certificates do you think they can do in an hour, when they have the reference? I would estimate 6 easily. 6 x £7 is £42, I know the staff don't earn that, I also know there are running costs for the buildings etc, but, if they never write another certificate out again, these buildings will still have to be maintained.

What about all the other expenses?
The ONS do not print the certificate forms, those are pre-printed and cost money to purchase.
Then there are the other production costs, the printers used to print the relevant details on the pre-printed certificate forms, the locating the correct registration, dechipering illegible registrations etc. etc. it all takes time and money.


The new charges will mean at the rate of 6 certificates an hour they will make £55.50 from these sales alone, that is not including the charges for special delivery. How can anyone say the cost of certificates is subsidised by the tax payer !!

Very easily as the accounts show they are.
In addition the ONS are under a legal requirement to set the fee they charge for their service at the price it costs. If you can prove they are overcharging then by all means take action and they will be forced to reduce the fee, but guessing at numbers is not proof.


I don't advocate a permanent boycot, but just one long enough to show them they need us. I know hobbies can be expensive, and I would expect to pay a fair price, but I don't consider £9.25 to be fair. Certificates without a reference are £8.50, so a rise of 75p is reasonable, but, a rise of £2.25 is not reasonable. I'd see no point finding references, which would mean staff would spend longer doing the certificates. Some people would not purchase them at this price, or at least buy less, so in the long run the ONS could come unstuck.

If genealogists stop buying certificates the ONS could lay off staff therby saving money. Is that what you really want?
The ONS would very happily only service those who require certificates for legal purposes and not family historians.
Cheers
Guy

[Bo Peep]

We can moan and groan, but the cost of certificates will be increased and there is nothing we can do about it. If we want them, we pay, it is as simple as that.