Thomas Watts: Where are you in 1891?

[Mandie]

I'm trying to tie up some loose ends with the Norfolk ancestors, and Thomas Watts is giving me particular trouble - he doesn't seem to exist in the 1891 census!

What I know
He was born, Thomas Leonard Watts, 11/11/1861 in Honing, Norfolk.
In the 1871 census [RG10/1794 Folio 116 Page 13] he is aged 9, and his birthplace is listed as Norfolk Worstead.
In the 1881 census [RG11/1919 Folio 133 Page 14] he is aged 19, and his birthplace is back to Honing.
In 1882 he married Christiana Cole in the parish of Smallburgh.
In 1884 their son Robert William Watts was born in the parish of Smallburgh.
In the 1891 census Robert William is listed with his paternal grandparents [RG12/1507 Folio 118 Page 8] James and Ann Watts.
In 1895 Christiana Watts nee Cole dies in parish of Smallburgh. {EDIT} Was not my Christiana! :(
On 24/12/1898 he marries Martha Helsdon.
In the 1901 census Thomas, Martha and Robert are all living in County Durham.

I've looked on Ancestry for Thomas Watts/Leonard Watts/Thomas Leonard/Thomas Cole (and the same variations for Christiana) and have gone through the parishes of Worstead and Smallburgh page-by-page, but with no luck.

Can anyone suggest what I could try next as a search? I admit I'm stumped.

[Geoffers]

I'm trying to tie up some loose ends with the Norfolk ancestors, and Thomas Watts is giving me particular trouble - he doesn't seem to exist in the 1891 census!
He was born, Thomas Leonard Watts, 11/11/1861 in Honing, Norfolk.
In the 1891 census Robert William is listed with his paternal grandparents
In 1895 Christiana Watts nee Cole dies.
In the 1901 census Thomas, Martha and Robert are all living in County Durham.

Where did Christiana die?

I've indexed this part of the 1891 census for Norfolk (it's on Paddy Apling's website) and I can confirm that your Thomas does not appear on the census for this area - though I don't have the census for North Walsham and this there are Watts entries there on:
RG12/1509 - 108/16, 120/39, 131/15, 136/25, 145/9, 147/13, 82/4, 88/16, 89/17, 89/18.

Have you discounted him being in Durham by 1891? I notce that in Worstead census there is the following entry:

RG12/1507 f121 p13 sch.91
Metting Hill, Worstead
Jonah WATTS, hd, mar, 31, labr, bn Horning
Elizabeth Watts, wf, mar, 27, bn Worstead
Jane Watts, dau, 3, bn Durham Washington
James Watts, son, 1, bn Worstead

Although born Horning rather than Honing (at least that's what the census says) could he be related to your Thomas? Maybe they travelled to Washington together and Jonah missed Norfolk, whilst Thomas stayed put?

Geoffers

[Mandie]

Where did Christiana die?
Oops! She died in the parish of Smallburgh. I'm waiting on the death certificate for her.


I've indexed this part of the 1891 census for Norfolk (it's on Paddy Apling's website) and I can confirm that your Thomas does not appear on the census for this area - though I don't have the census for North Walsham and this there are Watts entries there on:
RG12/1509 - 108/16, 120/39, 131/15, 136/25, 145/9, 147/13, 82/4, 88/16, 89/17, 89/18.

Have you discounted him being in Durham by 1891? I notice that in Worstead census there is the following entry:

RG12/1507 f121 p13 sch.91
Metting Hill, Worstead
Jonah WATTS, hd, mar, 31, labr, bn Horning
Elizabeth Watts, wf, mar, 27, bn Worstead
Jane Watts, dau, 3, bn Durham Washington
James Watts, son, 1, bn Worstead

Although born Horning rather than Honing (at least that's what the census says) could he be related to your Thomas? Maybe they travelled to Washington together and Jonah missed Norfolk, whilst Thomas stayed put?

Geoffers

I think that Jonah is his older brother (from info in the 1871 census). I've tried looking in Durham too, but since Christiana died in Norfolk it makes me think that they must have been around there somewhere. Could they just have been missed out/been absent from home, do you think? But, I will go through North Walsham page-by-page too, in case he's hiding in there!

[Pam Downes]

Hi Mandie,
Not necessarily the sort of suggestion you want but.....
in the 1851 census, it's quite well-known that the census pages for Dunmow(Essex) and the surrounding villages are missing, and ditto for Gautby (Lincs) in 1861.
Would anyone on the Durham list know if pages for 1891 are missing for a particular place? Or alternatively, do you think TNA would be able to supply such info?
Or is the family suffering from transcription trauma? Hatt(s)? Matt(s)? Natt(s)? When I get desperate I also substitute the vowels e.g. Wett(s), Witts, Wotts, Wutts. Other possibles that come to mind - Walt(s), Walls, and again all with the vowel substitute Well(s), Wilts, etc.
Worts (possibly mis-spelt as Warts if oop-north) is also another name to look at. When you went through the Smallburgh pages did you just look at the surnames. or did you look for Thomas and Christianas too as they could have been mis-spelt as Worts in Smallburgh?

Pam Downes

[Geoffers]

I think that Jonah is his older brother (from info in the 1871 census).Interesting that the birthplace for Jonah is Horning rather than Honing - in case you don't know, these are two different parishes.


I've tried looking in Durham too, but since Christiana died in Norfolk it makes me think that they must have been around there somewhere. Could they just have been missed out/been absent from home, do you think?Quite possibly tavelling to/from somewhere - the problem is where? I would guess that it might be Durham, but then there's an awful lot of ground inbetween the two


But, I will go through North Walsham page-by-page too, in case he's hiding in there!Going on from Pam's suggestion, the WORTS entries in North Walsham are:

North Walsham
RG12/1509
WORTS-134/22, 134/22, 137/27

Though the pronounced sound of the names in a Norfolk accent would have been different and I don't think they are variants of the same name - however, there are only three references in N.Walsham so it won't take long to check them as well. In case it helps, I'll tag onto this thread a surname index to Worstead, Honing and Smallburgh from the 1891 census, just in case it helps to find your family.

[Geoffers]

As promised, a surname index to several of the places in which you are interested, from the 1891 census:

Smallburgh
RG12/1507
BALDWIN-69/5 BAMBRIDGE-68/373/13 BARBER-67/1 BELL-71/9 BRISTOW-67/2 BROOKS-68/4, 69/6 BUCK-67/2
CHAPMAN-69/5, 73/13 COLMAN-67/1, 67/2 COX-70/8, 71/9, 72/12 CUBITT-68/4, 72/12 CULLEY-68/3 CURTIS-67/2
DARLAND?-69/5 DUGDALE-73/13 DURRELL-67/1, 71/9 DYBALL-67/2, 70/7
EDWARDS-72/12 ELLIS-68/3 EMPSON-69/5
FISKE-67/1, 68/4 FOREMAN-71/9 FOX-71/10 FROSDICK-67/1
GEDGE-71/9 GIBSON-67/1, 69/5 GLISTER-69/6 GRAY-67/1, 67/2 GRIFFITH-69/6
HALL-67/1, 67/2 HARMER-67/2, 71/10, 72/12 HAYNE-70/7, 73/13 HAYNES-72/11 HAZILL?-72/11 HILLERSDON-68/4
JAY-70/7, 70/8, 72/11, 72/12, 73/13 JONES-67/1
KERRISON-71/9 KNIGHTS-67/2, 70/7, 71/9, 72/11 KNOCKLES-69/6 KNOX-68/4

continued

[Geoffers]

Smallburgh 1891 census index part2
RG12/1507
LAMBERT-70/7, 71/10 LONG-68/4, 69/5, 70/7, 70/8, 71/10 LOWN-68/3
MILEHAM-70/7, 70/8
NEAVE-70/8 NOBBS-70/8, 71/9 NORMAN-71/9 NUTMAN-68/4
PALMER-67/1 PAYNE-67/1 PEGGS-71/9 POSTLE-67/1 PRATT-68/3, 70/7, 70/8, 71/10, 72/11, 73/13 PYCROFT-69/5
SANDERS-69/5 SAUL-72/12 SHEPHERD-72/11 SHREEVE-71/9, 71/10 SOUTHGATE-72/12 SPANTON-67/1 STEARMAN-69/5 STONE-69/6 SUFFLING-67/1
TAYLOR-67/1 THURLOW-67/1 TUCK-68/4
VINCENT-71/10, 73/13
WALPOLE-72/11 WATSON-68/4 WENN-69/6 WHITTLETON-68/3, 69/6, 70/7, 72/12 WOODHOUSE-68/4
YAXLEY-70/8, 71/9

[Geoffers]

Smallburgh Workhouse 1891 census index
RG12/1507
BALL-74/16 BARGEWELL-73/14 BARNARD-74/16 BESFORD-74/15 BR..PTON?-74/15 BRANDISH-73/14 BROWN-74/15 BUFFHAM-74/15 BULLEY-73/14
CLEVELAND-73/14 COLEBY-74/15 COOK-74/16 COOPER-73/14 CUBITT-73/14
DIXON-73/14 DUGDALE-74/15 DYBALL-73/14
GEORGE-74/15 GOODSON-74/15
HALL-73/14 HANNANT-73/14, 74/15 HARMER-74/15 HARVEY-74/16 HAYLETT-74/15 HUNTER-74/16
JARVIS-74/15 JOHNSON-74/15 JONES-74/15
KNIGHTS-74/15
LAND-74/15 LARTER-74/15 LAWES-74/15
MASON-74/16 MONEY-73/14
NASH-74/15 NEWLAND-74/16 NEWMAN-74/15
SELF-74/15 SLATFORD-74/16 SMITH-73/14, 74/15 SNELLING-73/14 SPOONER-74/15 SPRINGALL-74/15
THURGATE-74/15
WATTS-74/15, 74/16 WILSON-74/15

[Geoffers]

Worstead 1891 census index
RG12/1507
ADCOCK?-121/13 ALLEN-103/2 AMIES-108/12 ANDREW-119/9 ARTERTON-119/10 AVERRY-105/6
BACK-103/1 BAKER-117/6 BARNARD-103/1 BARRETT-111/17 BARTON-107/9 BEAN-120/12 BECK-108/12 BELL-108/11 BLOWER-106/8 BOINTER-118/7 BRAKENBURY-117/6 BREEZE-122/15 BROWN-118/7 BUCK-120/11 BULLIMORE-115/2 BURRELL-107/10 BURTON-118/8, 120/12
CARTER-107/10 CATCHPOLE-103/2 CHAMBERLIN-103/1 CHETTLEBURGH-110/16 CHILDS-122/15 CHUBBOCK-121/13 CLARKE-107/9, 110/16, 115/1 COLE-107/9, 115/1 COLMAN-106/7 COOPER-108/11, 116/3, 116/4, 117/5 COPPER-118/7 COPPING-103/2 COVELL-104/4, 109/14 CROSS-103/2, 108/12, 116/3, 118/7, 118/8 CUTTING-119/9
DALF-121/13 DAVISON-106/8, 108/12 DELF-119/9 DEWAIS?-119/9 DEXTER-105/5 DOWE-116/3 DRURY-109/14, 122/15 DUCKER-104/3 DUNTON-109/14 DYBALL-103/1
EVERARD-120/11 EVERETT-109/13
FARROW-104/3 FIDDY-108/12 FISHER-117/5 FLAXMAN-119/9 FOX-104/4
GAGE?-103/1 GEDGE-119/10, 120/11 GEE-121/13 GIBBS-107/10 GOWN-116/3 GRAVER-108/11, 121/14 GRIMES-105/5, 108/11, 109/14, 110/16, 116/3, 118/7, 121/14
HALES-116/4 HALL-118/8 HANNANT-108/11, 119/9 HARDY-105/5, 116/3 HARMER-117/5 HARVEY-119/9 HEARLE-105/6 HEWETT-118/7 HEWITT-120/12 HILL-109/13 HINDRY-105/6 HOLMES-121/13 HOOPER-116/3 HOWARD-120/11
JACKSON-119/10

[Geoffers]

Worstead 1891 census index continued
RG12/1507
KNIGHTS-108/11
LAKE-120/12 LEACH-103/1 LINCON-106/8 LING-104/3 LONG-103/2, 104/4, 105/5, 107/9, 109/14, 110/15 LONG-115/1, 115/2, 117/6 LOVEDAY-121/14, 122/15 LUBBOCK-103/2
MASON-118/8, 119/9 MCKEE-103/1 MEEK-106/8, 115/2 MIDDLETON-121/14 MOSES?-115/2 MYHILL-109/13
NEVAREL-103/1 NEWMAN-107/10 NEWTON-103/2 NOCKOLDS-118/7 NORGATE-116/3, 118/7 NUDD-109/13
OSWICK-106/8
PAGE-120/11 PESTELL-117/5 PITCHERS-103/2 PLUMMER-116/4 POINTER-105/5, 119/10, 120/11 POTTER-105/6 PRATT-110/15 PYCRAFT-105/6
ROCHE-119/10 ROPER-116/4, 120/12 ROWE-103/2 RUMP-104/3, 107/10, 119/9
SCOTT-117/5, 122/15 SELF-102/11, 118/8, 120/12, 122/15 SHREEVE-108/12 SIDELL-109/13, 121/14 SKIPPER-107/10 SKOULDING-109/13 SLADE-107/9 SLAPP-108/12 SLOPER-108/12 SMITH-104/4, 117/5, 117/6 SPALDING-104/4 STARLING-106/7 STEDMAN-108/11 STIBBON-115/1 STOLWORTHY-109/14 STOREY-106/7, 119/9 SUFFLING-108/12, 115/1
TAYLOR-115/1, 115/2 THIRTLE-118/7, 119/9, 120/12, 121/13 THURSTON-118/8 TOMPSON-118/8 TOOLEY-103/1 TRIGG-110/16 TURNER-116/3, 120/11
WARD-118/8 WATERS-103/1, 118/7 WATSON-106/7 WATTS-106/8, 115/1, 115/2, 117/6, 118/8, 121/13 WEBSTER-117/5, 119/9 WELDEN-122/15 WESTON-103/1 WHISKEN-103/1 WICK-120/12 WILKINS-109/13 WILLIAMS-116/3 WILLIMOTT-110/15 WILLS-119/10 WISEMAN-105/5, 115/2 WOODHOUSE-119/9, 121/14 WRIGHT-105/5, 107/9, 115/2, 118/7, 121/13, 121/14
YOUELS-107/10 YOUNGMAN-116/4

[Geoffers]

Honing 1891 census index
RG12/1507
ACTKINS-37/12 ANDREWS-35/8, 38/13
BACON-32/2, 33/4, 34/6 BAFFHAM-32/1 BALDWIN-35/7 BARBER-35/7 BARNARD-38/13 BECK-36/9, 36/10 BECKERSON?-32/1 BRANKENBURY-32/1 BROWN-35/8
COOPER-32/1, 37/11 CRANE-36/10 CROXON-37/11 CUBITT-35/7
DIXON-34/5 DUCKER-38/13 DURRELL-32/2
EKE-36/10
FLAXMAN-32/1, 34/5, 35/7, 36/10 FRANCIS-38/13
GEDGE-33/4, 34/6, 35/8, 36/9 GOTTS-38/13 GREEN-36/9, 37/12 GRIFFIN-37/11
HARMAR-35/7 HARMER-37/11 HAYNE-33/3 HILD-35/7 HOWLETT-32/2, 34/6 HUBBARD-33/3
JARVIS-37/12 JONES-35/7
LARTER-32/2 LARTER-37/11 LINES-32/1
MASON-36/10 MEEKS?-33/3 MOORE-36/10
NEAVE-35/7
PESTLE-34/6, 36/9 PLANE-37/12 PURDY-37/12
REMBLEN-37/12 RODGERS-32/2 ROLFE-35/7 ROPER-36/10
SADLER-32/2, 33/4, 34/6, 35/8 SADMAN-33/3 SCULFER-35/8 SLADE-35/7
THIRTLE-32/1, 33/4 TRIVETT-33/3, 34/6 TURNER-37/11
WARD-34/5 WATKINSON-37/11 WATSON-36/10 WEBSTER-32/2, 33/4, 34/6, 36/10, 37/11, 37/12 WELLS-38/13

[Geoffers]

As mentioned, the above is just a surname index to help you try and pick out possibles for your Thomas Watts. I believe the index to be accurate. If some other Norfolk parishes would help, just say which and if I have them I'll post them too.

Geoffers

[Jo Simpsons]

I have just been looking at the page, do you think that Thomas may have been called Robert? They only live near by, Robert, Christina and children, Ellen, Lottie, John, Bessie and Florence. Just a thought, but you know what thought did?

Jo :)

[Mandie]

Hi Mandie,
Not necessarily the sort of suggestion you want but.....
in the 1851 census, it's quite well-known that the census pages for Dunmow(Essex) and the surrounding villages are missing, and ditto for Gautby (Lincs) in 1861.
Would anyone on the Durham list know if pages for 1891 are missing for a particular place? Or alternatively, do you think TNA would be able to supply such info?
Or is the family suffering from transcription trauma? Hatt(s)? Matt(s)? Natt(s)? When I get desperate I also substitute the vowels e.g. Wett(s), Witts, Wotts, Wutts. Other possibles that come to mind - Walt(s), Walls, and again all with the vowel substitute Well(s), Wilts, etc.
Worts (possibly mis-spelt as Warts if oop-north) is also another name to look at. When you went through the Smallburgh pages did you just look at the surnames. or did you look for Thomas and Christianas too as they could have been mis-spelt as Worts in Smallburgh?

Pam Downes
Hi Pam,
Thanks for your suggestions, I've tried them all now and so far nothing that would be my Thomas has emerged.
I did look out for Thomas and Christiana too, but nothing that matched my pair. :(
I'm beginning to think that there may be a page/section missing, because Dennis Watts (Thomas's brother) is also missing. Or maybe Ancestrys coverage is patchy for 1891.

[Jo Simpsons]

sorry just seen 1881 and there is a Robert with a Christina.

Jo :o

[Mandie]

Interesting that the birthplace for Jonah is Horning rather than Honing - in case you don't know, these are two different parishes.

I didn't know they were in different parishes, although I knew they were different places. On the 1871 Jonah and most of the Watts are from Worstead.


Quite possibly tavelling to/from somewhere - the problem is where? I would guess that it might be Durham, but then there's an awful lot of ground inbetween the two

Going on from Pam's suggestion, the WORTS entries in North Walsham are:

North Walsham
RG12/1509
WORTS-134/22, 134/22, 137/27

Though the pronounced sound of the names in a Norfolk accent would have been different and I don't think they are variants of the same name - however, there are only three references in N.Walsham so it won't take long to check them as well. In case it helps, I'll tag onto this thread a surname index to Worstead, Honing and Smallburgh from the 1891 census, just in case it helps to find your family.

No Thomas in the Worts. Thank you for the surname index, it makes life much easier to find the entries and hopefully it will help me to find someone else since they all seem to live around those areas. As I just mentioned to Pam, I'm wondering about the coverage on Ancestry as Thomas's brother is missing too. Might check into that...

[Mandie]

I have just been looking at the page, do you think that Thomas may have been called Robert? They only live near by, Robert, Christina and children, Ellen, Lottie, John, Bessie and Florence. Just a thought, but you know what thought did?

Jo :)

Hi Jo,

I looked at that one a few times, but the ages are wrong for my pair. And as far as anyone knew Thomas and Christiana only had one child. Thanks for looking though! :)

[Steve Steere]

Hi Mandie,

Check again on Ancestry but just put in Thom* and the birthplace, ignore everything else. Browse the list to look for possible's, I suggest select the name and view other family members as it's quicker.

You will need to repeat this using Thos as that does not come up on the other search.

If there are too many pick a different family member with what you hope is a less common first name.

I have found some of mine indexed with the name of the family above them on the sheet, so you do have to go through them all that have the approximate ages unless you hit lucky with a misspelling straight away.

Regards,

Steve

[Mandie]

Hi Mandie,

Check again on Ancestry but just put in Thom* and the birthplace, ignore everything else. Browse the list to look for possible's, I suggest select the name and view other family members as it's quicker.

You will need to repeat this using Thos as that does not come up on the other search.

If there are too many pick a different family member with what you hope is a less common first name.

I have found some of mine indexed with the name of the family above them on the sheet, so you do have to go through them all that have the approximate ages unless you hit lucky with a misspelling straight away.

Regards,

Steve

Thanks Steve for the tips. I've tried all sorts of variations now on the spellings and what information I put in the search terms - but still nothing. But as more and more of the family are also untraceable it's looking as though a) either the page/folio is missing or b) Thomas and family were out of the county/country.

[Mandie]

Perseverance pays off with researching your family history. I knew Thomas Watts was missing from records for 14 years, and it was rumoured he had gone overseas. I had checked the census many times trying to find him and also records of him going overseas. No joy.

At Christmas 2004 I created a little booklet about what I'd discovered. It was passed on to a distant relative who has just been in contact to say that they have documents about Thomas (plus two brothers) attempting to become citizens in the USA (during the missing 14 years). They also have photos and other documents. We're all so happy and I wanted to post an update so people keep plugging away at things. Now we have to be patient as we wait for the post to bring the documents.