1619 Manoral Document

[Heather Bond]

I have a document that says it is from 1619, James 1st.
I can't read it, can anyone helps me?
Heather Bond

[Carmy]

We need to be able to see it. Can you scan it?

[Heather Bond]

yes i have a scan, how do I post it?
Heather

[Kerrywood]

We need to be able to see it. Can you scan it?

Heather, before posting an image of the document do please consider whether there are any copyright issues attaching to it? If you can say where it comes from, no doubt a Mod will advise. :)

Kerrywood

[Heather Bond]

I have the original document; in order to keep it at a size that you can read it would be better if those who are interested to please private email me and I will sent them a copy by email.
Kind Regards,
Heather

[Heather Bond]

The document can be viewed at:

https://share.acrobat.com/adc/document.do?docid=0a5fe15a-6726-41d9-b299-001b027afceb


Heather

[Vance Mead]

This is as much as I could figure out.

The first part is the view of frankpledge taken by Robert Lycesterie (?) sheriff . The eighth day of April the 17th year of the reign of James I.

The second part:
Robert Thomas senior came and paid into the hands of the lord for an enclosure called Cayworne (?) by estimation 5 acres, more or less, and one acre of land, plus some other bits of land
Now at the work and use of John Moris of the fee of the said Robert Thomas for the term of his life and after his decease to the work and use of Robert Thomas junior and Joan his wife and to the heirs of the said Robert Thomas junior.

[Kerrywood]

For what it's worth, I had a go at this too.

I think the view of frankpledge is taken by Robert Sidney, Earl of Leicester. The rest of it, as Vance says, is essentially a transfer of tenancy within the manor. Isn't John Moris the feoffe (trustee?).

I agree Cayworne -- but where is it? Do we know which county?

Kerrywood

[Heather Bond]

Wonderful! thank you so much!
Heather

[Vance Mead]

At first I thought that it might be an example of an Enfeoffment to Use, in which case John Moris would be the trustee. But this legal instrument was, if I remember correctly, abolished by the Statute of Uses in 1536, and anyway it was only used for freehold, not copyhold. So I think John Moris was merely a subtenant of Robert Thomas.

[Kerrywood]

Thanks, Vance, no doubt you're right on that point.

I wonder if the manor is Coity, Glamorgan?

Top left of the document:


coytie Wallia [Wales]

and from the first section:


p[re]clarissime Barbare ux[oris] eius ... apud castrum de coytie

Robert Sidney's wife was Barbara Gamage, daughter of John Gamage of Coity. Just a thought.

Kerrywood

[Heather Bond]

Kerrywood,
I have sent you a scan of the back of the document.
I think you may be right about Wales.
1619 was written in ballpoint pen on an old file cover
that holds the document, so it may not be the proper date.
Can you post the back page link for me.
I have to go to work.
Kind Regards to all.
Heather

[Vance Mead]

Kerrywood is definitely right about it being Coity, Wales.

I can't make out the first word but the rest is "belonging to Mr Sherwood"

[Kerrywood]

Thanks, Finbar.

Perhaps:

Coyty Wallia
Surr[ende]r? belonging to Mr Sherwood

That may support my suggestion of Coity, Glamorgan (see above)?

Heather, I think 1619 is correct. The date in the text is 8 April in the 17th year of the reign of King James [of England] and the 53rd year of his reign as King of Scotland. That seems to tally, as he acceded to the Scottish throne in 1567.

You can check English regnal years with this calculator (http://www.albion.edu/english/calendar/Regnal_Years.html).

Kerrywood

PS Vance types faster!

[Heather Bond]

Thank you to: Vince and Kerry for your help on this document.
I have read some very interesting stories on the internet of Robert Sidney
and Barbara and the their families. It would be interesting to know how a
small document like this could make it to Vancouver Island.

Kind Regards,
Heather