PDA

View Full Version : williams family



izzhan
19-11-2007, 1:01 AM
hi everyone,i would like to find out where my grandfather came from,i believe he was born in north petherton,<still waiting for birthdate>.he came to nz on the ship warwick i think around 1884.his full name was james toovey williams.i remember my father saying he used to live in a place called chapel hill,i have never been able to find any mention of this place.he was a younger son and they had a family crest.how i wish i had listened more to my fathers stories!!!i have very little information and very unsure how to go about looking,can anyone help me?

Trish
19-11-2007, 1:42 AM
hi everyone,i would like to find out where my grandfather came from,i believe he was born in north petherton,<still waiting for birthdate>.he came to nz on the ship warwick i think around 1884.his full name was james toovey williams.i remember my father saying he used to live in a place called chapel hill,i have never been able to find any mention of this place.he was a younger son and they had a family crest.how i wish i had listened more to my fathers stories!!!i have very little information and very unsure how to go about looking,can anyone help me?North Petherton, Somerset? There's the following family in the 1881 census with father James and son James:

Census: 1881: RG11/2372 Folio 77 Page 15
Address: High Street, North Petherton, Somerset
-- James Williams Head M 40 Builder [born] Somerset, North Petherton
-- Elizabeth Williams Wife M 40 [born] Do Do
-- Sarah Williams Daur Unm 14 Scholar [born] Do Do
-- Robert Williams Son 10 Do [born] Do Do
-- James Williams Son 8 Do [born] Do Do
-- Walter Williams Son 6 Do [born] Do Do
-- Henry Williams Son 4 Do [born] Do Do
-- Fred Williams Son 2 [born] Do Do
-- Illegible Son 5 weeks [born] Do Do

However, this James is not a younger son. He appears to be son #2.

Do you know if your James travelled to New Zealand on his own or with his family? If by himself, this James would have been only 11 years old or so in 1884. If with his family, I doubt this is them since they are still in North Petherton in 1891 -- without James but with another son, Sidney, 6. The son unnamed above is Thomas, 11, in the 1891 census. [Reference: RG12/1881 Folio 56 Page 2]

As for a possible James, aged about 18, of this family, in 1851: I don't see him anywhere in England unless his birthplace is listed under another name in Somerset.

Trish

Trish
19-11-2007, 2:01 AM
Hmmm, I may have found the missing James from the 1881/1891 family I gave you details for. This looks like him in 1891:

Census: 1891: RG12/4406 Folio 41 Page 4
Address: Cadoxton Juxta Barry, Glamorgan, Wales
-- Mary Jane De Witt Head 56 Wid Restaurant Keeper [born] Somerset Chetton [or Chilton] Palden ?Moorlinch?
-- Sidney De Witt Son S 25 Baker + Confectioner [born] Do ?Moorlinch? Edington
-- Ada Louise De Witt Daur S 18 [born] Bristol
-- John Williams Son, in law M 22 Builder [born] Somerset North Petherton
-- Anna Sophia Williams Daur M 24 [born] Do Moorlinch
-- James Williams Boarder S 19 Builder [born] Do North Petherton

If this is your James then he left for NZ much later than 1884.

Trish

izzhan
19-11-2007, 3:08 AM
thank you so much trish! i think we might be on to something,as far as i know he came out here by himself,a brother may have joined him later.its very exciting,i would think he would have been a young man when he came here as my father was born in 1903,and he was the 2nd child of 4.

izzhan
19-11-2007, 3:14 AM
hi trish,i maybe wrong about1884,i was basing that on a passenger list that a james williams arrived on the ship warwick on april14,1884.i know he lived in auckland for awhile before moving north to whangarei with his family where he farmed.i know they were a strong catholic family and that his middle name"toovey" was a family name.thanks

Trish
19-11-2007, 3:20 PM
hi trish,i maybe wrong about1884,i was basing that on a passenger list that a james williams arrived on the ship warwick on april14,1884.i know he lived in auckland for awhile before moving north to whangarei with his family where he farmed.i know they were a strong catholic family and that his middle name"toovey" was a family name.thanksizzhan,

Could his middle name have been spelled "Tovey" in official records? As a matter of interest, apparently Toovey/Tovey is a Norman surname and means "the son of Tofig" or "Tovi" -- from A Dictionary of English and Welsh Surnames.

I can't unearth a Williams/Toovey connection in Somerset in the records I have access to. Perhaps someone else can....

At any rate, it may help to know that the 19-year-old James Williams of North Petherton, living in Wales in 1891, appears to have moved on by 1901. I don't see him there. He doesn't seem to have returned to North Petherton. However, brother John and his wife Ana Sophia have returned with their children.

But no sign of the De Witts. Not in Wales or England. So, if this is your James, he could have departed for NZ at some time between 1891 and 1901.

One clue to look for when trying to tie in your James with this family is to look for common first names. Do you see any with your father and his siblings -- Elizabeth, John, Sarah, Robert, Walter, Henry, Fred, Thomas, Sidney? Most of these are fairly common names but you may see some sort of pattern...

Trish

Trish
19-11-2007, 3:29 PM
It may help to know that the Williams parents are still in North Petherton in 1901:

Census: 1901: RG13/2281 Folio 128 Page 1
Address: Tappers Lane, North Petherton, Somerset
-- James Williams Head M 61 Carpenter Employer [born] Somerset North Petherton
-- Elizabeth Do Wife M 60 [born] Do Do
-- Thomas Do Son S 20 Brick Layer [born] Do Do
-- Sidney Do Son S 16 Carpenter [born] Do Do

Along with John and Ana Sophia, living nearby:

Census: 1901: RG13/2281 Folio 128 Page 2
Address:Tappers Lane, North Petherton, Somerset
-- John Williams Head M 32 Carpenter [born] Somerset North Petherton
-- Anna Sophia Do Wife M 34 [born] Do Edington
-- Adam J.S. Do Son S 9 Scholar [born] Glamorgan St. Nicholas
-- Ada Edith Do Daur S 7 Do [born] Birmingham ?Deritend?
-- Rosa Elizabeth Do Daur S 6 Do [born] Do Do
-- Frederick J. Do Son S 1 [born] Somerset North Petherton

By the way, I just checked Hugh Wallis' site for middle names and couldn't see any Tooveys/Toveys in Somerset. Take a look for yourself. You may find other things of interest on the site.

Trish