Accessing Metropolitan Police service records remotely

[geoffpowers]

I am anxious to research my father's service record with the Metropolitan Police, and have had no opportunity to date to visit the National Archives. Is there any means of accessing this information remotely, or will I have to employ the services of a professional researcher?

I am fairly certain that his early career, with City of Birmingham Police, from approx. 1896-1901, was spent probably in the Edgbaston area of the city, where he met his first wife.

He served in the Metropolitan Police from at least 1903, when his first son - my half-brother - was born. His son's birth was registered in Marylebone. I believe my father served in St. John's Wood (D Division?) for most of his period of of service. He rose to the rank of police sergeant. There is a family 'memoir' that he was involved in the apprehension and arrest of Dr Harvey Crippen.
approx. 1896-1901, was spent probably in the Edgbaston area of the city, where he met his first wife.

He served in the Metropolitan Police from at least 1903, when his first son - my half-brother - was born. His son's birth was registered in Marylebone. I believe my father served in St. John's Wood (D Division?) for most of his period of of service. He rose to the rank of police sergeant. There is a family 'memoir' that he was involved in the apprehension and arrest of Dr Harvey Crippen.

If the regulation was in force that there was compulsory retirement for police officers at the age of 50, my father would have retired in 1926.

[Lindad]

Hi Geoff

Check out Police Orders. You won't be able to access the full records, but it is a very useful site and will give dates of joining, promotions, transfers, retirement etc. as well as the shoulder numbers of Metropolitan Police Officers.

[geoffpowers]

Thanks for this info.

Unfortunately the Met. Police database is 'down' at present. Also, for some strange reason they do not like web-based email addresses like mine. Do they pose some sort of security risk, do you think?

In frustration,

Geoff

[Peter Goodey]

Not that only that but you have to give your phone number - which must not be a mobile!

I don't think I'd have any intention of registering with that sort of site.

[Lindad]

Hmmm... they appear to have changed the registration process since I last used the site. Shame - as I previously got an awful lot of very useful information from it.

[Geoffers]

[I am anxious to research my father's service record with the Metropolitan Police, and have had no opportunity to date to visit the National Archives. Is there any means of accessing this information remotely, or will I have to employ the services of a professional researcher?....He served in the Metropolitan Police from at least 1903]

The Met deposit their records at TNA and I'd suggest that a visit is needed to check them properly.

Two sets of documents seem likely to help you:

1) Attestation Ledgers in MEPO4/352-360

2) Register of leavers MEPO4/339-351

Also there are various photos of stations in MEPO14 and other photos in MEPO13.

Geoffers
Charlbury, Oxfordshire

[Steve Steere]

Up to a few months there was a Met Police Museum, never open to the public but accessible to researchers by writing to the museum at the New Scotland Yard address. Unfortunately the management closed it down, and I hear that they are going through the records with a view to throwing out some of them, which are probably the divisional books that give so much information for family researchers.

I do know that pressure is being applied through various people on the Met to re-open it, but suspect that their intention is to hand it all over to a commercial organisation for them to run it, as was tried not so long ago.
I suggest you write asking for that information that is held at the museum, the more people write the better chance of keeping it. |help|

As to the police orders site the web master has had ill-health so has not been able to do much, plus the site was being used by people taking the information then using it for commercial gain (medal collectors). I can assure everyone that the integrity of the site is beyond reproach.
I do have personal knowledge of all this.

[geoffpowers]

Belated thanks for these last two postings: I had not looked at this bit of our forum for some three weeks due to family visits etc. over Christmas and the New Year.

Reluctantly I had concluded that I would probably need to visit TNA sooner or later - looks as if it will have to be sooner!

I understood from recent postings that the problems with the Police Orders web site are beyond the scope of the webmaster and are to do with the remote server. Thanks for vouching for its integrity anyway.

It is alarming to hear that info. is possibly disappearing from the Met Museum - have they caught the 'shredding' disease from HM civil servants?
What about the Freedom of Information Act? Can TNA not intercede? I will probably protest in writing. A person's name and adress would be very handy
if you know it.
%0t postings that the problems with the Police Orders web site are beyond the scope of the webmaster and are to do with the remote server. Thanks for vouching for its integrity anyway.

It is alarming to hear that info. is possibly disappearing from the Met Museum - have they caught the 'shredding' disease from HM civil servants?
What about the Freedom of Information Act? Can TNA not intercede? I will probably protest in writing. A person's name and adress would be very handy
if you know it.

Regards

Geoff

[Steve Steere]

Hi Geoff,

This has been going on for many months, and MP's are involved plus I read (in the Police Pensioners Magazine) that Lord Tebbitt had also joined in.

I have heard (hearsay!) that the old Bow Street Police Station has been sold off cheaply, rather than almost given away, which is what they tried to do last time. The plan was for a private profit making company to take over the exhibits and open a museum. This previous plan was scuppered but no doubt is still in the pipeline. A profit making company is unlikely to give free access to researchers, even if it did keep the old books. There is a lot of internal politics on the Museum over the last few years that cannot be put to print that also plays a part.

The books I mention kept note of everyone who joined a Division by their shoulder number, so through some books you could trace your ancestor for joining to leaving by looking at the different station books. I do not know if these are the ones that might go, but to the untrained, and the management are so, (the deputy curator had done a museum uni course - no curator - another story cannot & will not tell in public), these books look like mundane records.

I would suggest you write to your MP expressing concern, and he then forwards it the relevant Government department. We are on difficult ground because the Met Police are now run by the Met Police Authority (part of the Greater London Authority under the Mayor) instead of the Home Office. The MPA have said that they do not own the Museum so we have that problem over whose control it comes under.

I do not know about the Freedom of Information Act effect on the Museum records. I read in the Telegraph that some Government departments were shredding documents before it came in, maybe the Met has done the same. It then saves looking things up! In any case you have to know what they have there to ask for, otherwise they will refer you to the TNA where the main records are held.

Good luck with your research.

Steve