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sdgray22
24-10-2007, 6:05 PM
I have quite a lot of info and records for these 2 places always willing to help anyone, cant promise anything but I will always look in my records for you.

lorna4
15-03-2008, 12:56 PM
hi there,
i am looking for any information of the beavises from swanton morley, if i give you names such as harry beavis who was born in 1883 swanton morley and his wife annie todd who was born in north walsham, i believe they were in married in 1910. it would be nice to find out if they were married in the all saints church in swanton morley.
i have other look up like where there children were christened. marshall, cecil, willie don, stanley robert, phyliss, and peter jack.
best wishes lorna4

Geoffers
15-03-2008, 3:07 PM
In case sdgray's records don't cover this period, you can always order a copy of the marriage certificate either from the GRO, or at the local registrar.

The 1891 census shows what appears to be your Harry with his family:

RG12/1553 f72 p2
Swanton Morley
George BEEVIS, hd, mar, 35, ag.lab, bn Swanton Morley
Sarah Beevis, wf, mar, 35, bn Mattishall Burgh
Herbert W, son, 15, baker
Beatrice, son, 13
Charles S, son, 11, scholar
Harry G, son, 8, scholar
Louise M, dau, 4, scholar
Helena K, dau, 2
(all children bn Swanton Morely)

fare y'well tergether

sdgray22
16-03-2008, 12:25 PM
Beavis is a name that pops up in Swwanton Morley Parish registers a lot
below are the ones I have
Swanton Morley marriages 1837-1891 All Saints
1st April 1854 George Pearce and Esther Beavis both signed with X both of SM by banns witnesses William Beavis and John Canham officiating minister William Millett
25th Nov 1854 william Beavis and Sarah Ann Hudson both signed with X both of SM by banns witnesses John Margeson and John Canham officiating minister Henry Tacy
18th Nov 1882
Henry Beevis and Naomi Jane Smith he signed with X she signed her name both of SM by banns witnesses James Thomas Smith and Ruth Esther Smith officiating minister Walter G Morgan Curate
and guess what one of yours married one of mine!!!
15th Oct 1886 William Beevis and Amelia Jex he signed with an X she signed her name both signed with X both of SM by banns witnesses James Gittens and Ellen Jex officiating minister Walter G Morgn Curate
(if you want my ged file please get in touch e mail is sdgray22 (at) sky.com)
There are quite a few Beavis memorials and burials in the churchyard I have all those if you want them too various baptisms so get back to me and I will send them all to you.
sorry but 1910 is a bit later than the records I have which are mostly 19th century
Sharon

Geoffers
16-03-2008, 12:43 PM
In view of the above, and your wish to get details of......


i believe they were in married in 1910. it would be nice to find out if they were married in the all saints church in swanton morley

You'll now need to purchase the marriage certificate, you will now need to refer to the records of the registrar, either locally or via the GRO.

If you use the GRO, you can order online here (http://www.gro.gov.uk/gro/content/)
using the following reference

1910 December
BEAVIS, Henry G
Wayland
Vol 4b Page 691

(The above entry is duplicated with him also entered under Harry)

If you are not sure about the system for civil registration, please ask.

robbieuk
04-12-2008, 1:28 PM
Hello,

Please could you check to see whether there are any mentions of this surname in Swanton Morley? Especially a Mary or Bridget Engledow baptised in the 1710s/1720s. These sisters married Barnabas Dunnell and Stephen Andrews respectively, and lived over in enighbouring Weston/Morton/Attlebridge parishes. But perhaps they came from SM?

Many thanks for your time.
Rob

Mitch in Notts
04-12-2008, 8:31 PM
Sharon,

I`d be very interested in any details for the Parfrement/Perfrement surnames in both places as I`m doing a one-name study. I have a few records from those two villages but would be grateful for any detail you have. Many thanks.

Mitch

sdgray22
05-12-2008, 11:45 AM
Hello,

Please could you check to see whether there are any mentions of this surname in Swanton Morley? Especially a Mary or Bridget Engledow baptised in the 1710s/1720s. These sisters married Barnabas Dunnell and Stephen Andrews respectively, and lived over in enighbouring Weston/Morton/Attlebridge parishes. But perhaps they came from SM?

Many thanks for your time.
Rob
Robbie I have Ingledow and Engledow as follows
all these records below are transcribed by Mid Norfolk Family History Society
All Saints Church Swanton Morley Baptisms 1784-1837
bap 25/3/1794 born 24/3/1794 Martha daughter of John Ingledow and Mary (sp Riches)
bap 4/1/1797 born 3/1/1797 Mary Ann daughter of John Ingledow and Mary (sp Riches)
bap 8/5/1799 born 5/5/1799 Rose daughter of John Ingledow and Mary (sp Riches)
bap 4/9/1822 born 1/9/1822 John son of Richard Whitterick and Rose (sp Engledow)
bap 8/1/1824 born 7/1/1824 John son of Richard Whitterick and Rose (sp Ingledow)
Marriages 1837-1891
29/8/1840 William Shepherd a widow married Martha Ingledow spinster he signed she made a cross both of this parish by banns, witnesses Mary Peachman and John Canham officiating minister Henry Tacy
I have been through all my records and this is all there is note there are no burials so the family probably moved on
Sharon

sdgray22
05-12-2008, 12:25 PM
Sharon,

I`d be very interested in any details for the Parfrement/Perfrement surnames in both places as I`m doing a one-name study. I have a few records from those two villages but would be grateful for any detail you have. Many thanks.

Mitch
Mitch
Parfrement and Perfrement
All records transcribed by Mid Norfolk Family History Society
Burial Registers of St Nicholas East Dereham part2 1776-1908
entry 4333 parfrement Ann age 68 Wife of Philip East Dereham 3/4/1852
entry 4314 Parfement Philip age 32 from East Dereham 2/11/1851
entry 1572 Parfrement Sarah spinster age 23 28/12/1807
entry 1911 Parfement Mary age 72 wife of samuel Scarning 25/8/1814
entry 4496 Parfrement Philip age 75 from East Dereham 2/8/1854
All Saints Church Swanton Morley Baptisms 1784-1837
28/10/1788 James son of William Fleming and Margaret (Parfrement-sp)
28/10/1790 born 26/8/1790 Ruth daughter of William Fleming and Margaret (Parfrement-sp)
25/9/1796 born 22/9/1796 Lovey illegitimate daughter of Susanna Parfrement
14/5/1797 born 7/5/1797 Maria daughter of William Fleming and Margaret (Parfrement-sp)
2/9/1799 born 29/8/1799 Amy daughter of William Fleming and Margaret (Parfrement-sp)
23/2/1802 born 14/2/1802 Sophia daughter of William Fleming and Margaret (Parfrement-sp)
9/5/1803 born 7/5/1803 Mary Illegitimate daughter of Susanna Parfrement
4/6/1804 born 2/6/1804 William son of William Fleming and Margaret (Parfrement-sp)
2/1/1807 born 2/1/1807 Rebecca daughter of William Fleming and Margaret (Parfrement-sp)
9/4/1809 born 7/4/1809 Elizabeth daughter of William Fleming and Margaret (Parfrement-sp)
7/10/1812 born 5/10/1812 Charlotte daughter of William Fleming and Margaret (Parfrement-sp)
Memorial Inscriptions All Saints Church Swanton Morley
entry grave E75 headstone with a gothic shaped top (inscription face flaking)
This/stone erected/to the memory of/William Parfrement/died May 2nd 1885/aged 74 years
All Saints Church Swanton Morley Burials 1838-1891
17/10/1851 Susanna Parfrement abode Swanton Morley age 75
6/5/1885 William Parfrement abode Gressenhall Union House age 74
Note Gressenhall Workhouse is a museum and you can ask to see records

Hope this helps
Sharon

Mitch in Notts
05-12-2008, 7:02 PM
Many many thanks for that Sharon, much appreciated.

Mitch.

robbieuk
17-02-2009, 2:36 AM
A much belated thank you for posting the info here. I've only just logged back in after a wee break from family history.
I came back with a vengeance though and hit NRO ~ seems the Engledows lived in Elsing but tended to use Lyng church.

Only this month I've linked my Engledow ancestor to the Lyng family: from searching the Court Roll of Weston and the registers of Weston and Lyng I have gone back another four generations to the early 17th century. This makes me a happy family historian.

Thanks again.

Neilatdurham
17-03-2009, 2:11 PM
Robbie, A long time ago I came across Mary Ingledow b/bap Swanton Morley 26/2/1714 parents William and Margaret. Also found William 4/3/1716, Henry 10/8/1723, martha 27/12/1725 and another William (presume first one died) 17/5/1728. There is a confusion because I have will of William Engledow of Swanton Morley d1774 which quotes his wife as Martha but I suspect they may be same couple or remarriage. The Engledows in the will seem to be very rich owning farms etc. Hope this helps. Neil

Neilatdurham
17-03-2009, 2:38 PM
Hi Robbie, My Engledows were also at Elsing- it sounds like we are searching the same thing. If you have any info linked to and prior to William of Swanton Morley died 1774 and his wife Margaret or Martha I would appreciate you sharing it with me. My link with him is via his son Henry (1723-1775), and grandson John who moved to Sunderland, Tyne & Wear where he built up a very successful bakery business.

Ta much Neil

Staffy1
17-03-2009, 5:53 PM
Hi,

I saw your posting regarding records for East Dereham and i was wondering if you might be able to help me. I am currently researching my family tree - specifically the name STAFF(E) and have hit something of a brick wall. I was wondering if you had any information or records on a William & Elizabeth STAFFE who both died in 1724 in East Dereham. All i know about them is that William died on 15th January 1724 and was buried at St Nicholas Church, East Dereham. I am trying to establish how old they were when they died, if they had any children or if they were children themselves or who there parents were?
I know it's a long shot but any information you could provide would be GREATLY appreciated!

Many Thanks

James

Geoffers
17-03-2009, 6:12 PM
William & Elizabeth STAFFE who both died in 1724 in East Dereham. All i know about them is that William died on 15th January 1724 and was buried at St Nicholas Church, East Dereham. I am trying to establish how old they were when they died

Norfolk parish registers of this period very rarely mention an age. What is the source for the deaths? Have you tried the parish registers?

The Hearth Tax returns from 1664 and 1666 do not mention the surname in or near to Dereham so it doesn't seem to be a locally established name.

Staffy1
17-03-2009, 6:50 PM
The source for the information was from FREEREG website, unfortunately the information is very sketchy. I am wondering if they were a husband and wife that died within months of each other or possibly sibblings who died within months of each other. Would the burial records show who the parents were?

sdgray22
18-03-2009, 2:27 AM
I am sorry but my records start in 1776. The name Staff or Staffe does not appear in any of my records, ie nobody with that name was buried in St Nicholas churchyard from 1776 onwards to 1908, and no marriages between 1816-1855. i have also looked at the records that I have for the villages around East Dereham and I cannot trace that name at all. Sorry I cannot help - you may need to access the earlier parish records. Contact the Norfolk Record Office through their website to find out where copies of earlier records are kept. Unless anyone else knows where they are kept, perhaps they would let us know if they do. I do know there is a very good Local History section with lots of early records at East Dereham Library and the Staff are really helpful.
Sharon

Neilatdurham
20-03-2009, 2:22 PM
Sorry I do not have any reference to name Staffe in my tree.

Geoffers
20-03-2009, 5:01 PM
I am wondering if they were a husband and wife that died within months of each other or possibly sibblings who died within months of each other. Would the burial records show who the parents were?


Parish registers from this period tend to contain little detail; you might get parents names in the case of a child's death, you might get an (approximate) age in the case of an elderly death. In the case of an unusual cause of death that might also be noted.

Any wills on NROCAT?

Staffy1
21-03-2009, 11:56 AM
Hi,

I have tried NROCAT for wills or anything at all and that was a negative unfortunately, we are going to make the long trip to Norfolk fairly soon so i'll have to check at the records office.

robbieuk
26-07-2009, 1:18 PM
I always like to tie up lose ends.

I have found the Engledow/Ingledow family I was seeking, through an examination of Court Rolls and early Parish Registers of Weston Longville I was given the clue that the Ingledow family who married into the Dunnell alias Dunning family had connections with Hethersett.

Lo and behold, a nice set of baptism records in Hethersett provided a link to a marriage in Norwich and athe Lyng/Elsing family of Engledow.



More at my blog: robertmbatesdoesfamilytree.blogspot.com

pennydog
26-07-2009, 3:57 PM
Are you still willing to do Look-ups? If so could you see if you have anything on The family of John Brown Bap dec 1820 at Swanton Morley. Thankfully his father was called Hebron Anstead Brown and his mother Hannah. I believe that they used some 'colourful names for their offspring i.e Ethelinda, Gale, Thomas Anstead & the obligatory Mary Ann! Any details of Hannah Gale would be welcomed. Hebron was born in Taverham (his siblings were Mentor Herber Ezer Uzziel Anstead Browne - brother; Ethelinda Anstead Browne - sister; Jurusha Helah Anstead Brown - sister; and Hepzibah Jedidah Anstead Brown - sister). I hope to get to the Norwich records office in September and any info before I go would be really useful, so that I can maximise my time there.

sdgray22
27-07-2009, 10:51 AM
I have found the family but probably no more than you know. The name Gale is not present in the village apart from Hannah from the late 1700s to late 1800s, so she does not originate from the village neither does Hebron as you know. He obviously moved to the village as a papermaker (there was a papermaking works there).

Baptisms of all children are transcribed by NFHS in Swanton Morley All Saints Parish Registers 1784-1837
Mary Ann Brown bap 21/5/1826
John Brown born 15/12/1820 and bap 17/12/1820
Ethelinda bap 12/11/1828
Gale bap 1/8/1830
Thomas Anstead bap 10/6/1827

Brown is a name that appears in the village registers all the time before and after this family - so there may well have been relatives here before they arrived and after they had gone.

Sharon Gray

pennydog
27-07-2009, 1:25 PM
Thanks so much for that, Sharon - I will not have to search the records for Swanton Morely, which gives me more time to spend on Taverham (still want to visit the villiage though!) and the other Norfolk villiages where the 'other side' of the family came from. It is nice to add the info that Hebron worked at a papermaking works in the villiage.
Once again Thank you.

jimgat
04-08-2009, 2:16 PM
I 've located a marriage in Swanton Morley for Robert Gathercole & Anne Johnson in 1745. But the parish records are missing for the next 15 yrs or so. So I can't locate baptisms of any children. I have located a marriage for Robert Gathercole from East Dereham & Susanna Stagg(Shipdham) in 1778 in Shipdham.

I believe Robert is son of Robert & Ann from Swanton Morley but I have no proof without baptism record . So what other records are there that can help me prove relation.


Jim Gathercole

Geoffers
04-08-2009, 2:35 PM
Welcome to the B-G forums


I 've located a marriage in Swanton Morley for Robert Gathercole & Anne Johnson in 1745. But the parish records are missing for the next 15 yrs or so. So I can't locate baptisms of any children. I have located a marriage for Robert Gathercole from East Dereham & Susanna Stagg(Shipdham) in 1778 in Shipdham.

So what other records are there that can help me prove relation.

When you mention 'parish records' - do you mean the parish registers?

If so, then you could try the annual copy made of the register entries. In Norfolk for 6 years out of every 7, the annual copy was returned to the Archdeacon and so is known as the 'Archdeacon's Transcript' (AT). In the seventh year, the copy was returned to the Bishop and known as the 'Bishop's Transcript' (BT). The Norfolk Record Office has ATs and BTs on fiche; you may be able to hire copies on film via mormon church (LDS) record centres. Not all eyars have survived, but it may be worth pursuing as an alternative source.

sdgray22
05-08-2009, 2:32 AM
The name Gathercole or Gathercoal is a name that is scattered across mid norfolk and cambridge during the 1700s and early 1800s. It is very difficult to connect Robert Gathercole and Ann Johnson from Swanton Morley with any children. Mid 1700s are obviously a problem with Swanton Morley registers. I have looked through my records and although I can find various Gathercoles there is nothing that connects to this couple. Can I suggest that you look at the Mid Norfolk Family History Society website they have a very full burial index that might help you.
tsites.co.uk/sites/mnfhs/content/view/1/27/
sorry I can't be of more help.
Sharon Gray

Roger47
02-11-2009, 6:31 PM
Hi I bet you are wondering if your offer was such a good idea
So while you are still able to cope I wondered if you can find any trace of
John Took born 1757 I believe in either Swanton Morley or East Dereham he married Mary Anderson on 24 Nov 1789 in Swanton Morley and would be interested in the birth of either of them
John Took my G/G/Grandfather married again after Mary died in1799 he remarried in Apr 1800 to a K?Cathleen Balls and between both wives he had 6 children Robert ( my Great Grandfather ) Elizabeth, Charlott, James William, and George

Any mention of these names would be a great help it seems both sides on my family came from around the East Dereham area My Lingwood's from Washbridge E/Dereham

Many Thanks Roger L:)

sdgray22
03-11-2009, 2:08 PM
I am not going to be much help to you the only things I have found are 4 baptisms of JOHN TOOK AND MARY ANDERSONS s children

Swanton Morley Baptism All Saints Church Swanton Morley 1784 - 1837 transcribed by Mid Norfolk FHS

1789 Charlotte bap and born 21/5/1789 illeg dau of Mary Anderson
1794 James bap 12/10/1794 born 10/10/1794 son of John Tooke and Mary Anderson
1798 William born and bap 11/5/1798 son of John Tooke and Mary Ansderson
1803 Elizabeth born and bap 7/5/1803 dau of John Tooke and Catherine Balls

I have only a few records pre 1800
Sorry about that Sharon

Roger47
06-11-2009, 1:39 PM
I think you have been a whole lot of help Sharon an a Great Big THANK YOU
for your help maybe I should join the Mid Norfolk FHS
Shame they don't say whether the Illegal child was John's or another admirer

Many Thanks Roger L|hug|





I am not going to be much help to you the only things I have found are 4 baptisms of JOHN TOOK AND MARY ANDERSONS s children

Swanton Morley Baptism All Saints Church Swanton Morley 1784 - 1837 transcribed by Mid Norfolk FHS

1789 Charlotte bap and born 21/5/1789 illeg dau of Mary Anderson
1794 James bap 12/10/1794 born 10/10/1794 son of John Tooke and Mary Anderson
1798 William born and bap 11/5/1798 son of John Tooke and Mary Ansderson
1803 Elizabeth born and bap 7/5/1803 dau of John Tooke and Catherine Balls

I have only a few records pre 1800
Sorry about that Sharon

Roger47
06-11-2009, 2:11 PM
Sorry Sharon I meant to add that John Took and Catherine Balls went to live in East Dereham My Great Grandfather Robert Took was born there on the 1 Sep 1805 and his brother George Took in 1807 ( not sure of date )
Again many thanks for your help

Roger L:)

sdgray22
07-11-2009, 11:54 PM
I do have a burial at st Nicholas Church East dereham
John Tooke 59 labourer 23/11/1848
Sharon

WendyS
01-03-2011, 7:18 AM
Hi Sharon.
I do hope this thread is still going, so posting in anticipation.

My Great Great Grandfather was born in East Dereham 13/6/1800, and baptised in 'prive' on 13/7/1800.
He is recorded in the St. Nicholas parish records as illegitimate.
Named Frederic Leake.
Mother Susannah Smith.

He married Elizabeth Breeze (from the well known De Lieu line), in Bethnal Green 1838, using the name Frederick Smith.

I have all of his information from census'.

What I don't have and can't find is his mother's family, and who his father was.
Using an educated guess, I found a Susannah Smith born 1781 in the area, and a possible father candidate in Samuel Leake, born 1779 in East Dereham. But I would really like to confirm these people either way.

The Susannah I found had possible parents Bartholomew Smith and Mary Trollop. Possible siblings Ann, Mary, John and a 2nd John.

Would there have been any form of certificate that would have any names to help out?

I live in Australia, so can't access the many parishes and records offices:(

Any help or suggestions greatly appreciated.

sdgray22
02-03-2011, 1:57 AM
Wendy, yes it still works. Only thing is my records are not going to be of any great help to you. No Leake anywhere, I have Smiths in East Dereham burials (quite a lot ) one of interest could be Burial; Susanna Smith inf Daug of Susanna East Dereham. From The Burial Registers of The Church of St Nicholas East Dereham Part 2 (1776-1908) transcribed by the Mid Norfolk Family History Society.

Because the dates you are looking for are all pre 1837 there will be no certificates only entries in Parish Registers. Have you tried looking at the original Norfolk Parish Registers that are on the new familysearch.org site go to http://pilot.familysearch.org/recordsearch/start.html#start
click on search or browse our record collections, click on Europe on map wait for list then scroll down to United Kingdon and then Norfolk Parish registers wait for list then scroll down to East Dereham. They are all there, you can see the original entries
if you go to East Dereham Baptisms 1679-1812 page 167 of 295 one from the bottom on the left hand page is birth of Susannah Smith.
I hope the moderater on this forum is OK with me giving these instructions, they could help a lot of people who dont know about the original Norfolk parish registers being on line
Sharon

Pam Downes
02-03-2011, 3:59 AM
Hi Sharon and Wendy,
There are basically no problems with giving URLs, the major rule being that you must not give direct links to commercial sites or sites that ask for money/donations. If you are ever in any doubt either split the URL over two lines e.g. www.
abcde.co.uk or write 'abcde.co.uk - put www. in front'.
It's all in the AUP (http://www.british-genealogy.com/forums/announcement.php?f=402) (Acceptable User Policy) - scroll down to 'Links' in the first message.

It's a bit of a mouthful but this provides a direct link to the Norfolk PR images on the Familysearch site.
https://www.familysearch.org
/s/image/show#uri=http%3A//pilot.familysearch.org/records/collection/1416598/waypoints&hash=Mrd8SMocDIIen2Q83tu%252B82PRagg%253D
Those last two lines should jig together and then it's relatively easy to run your cursor to the front of it and type in the familysearch bit. Just remember to bookmark it. :smile5:
Pam

sheilastain
02-03-2011, 2:59 PM
Hi Sharon

I am interested in Swanton Morley. I have a couple of people in my tree with deaths recorded there. I wonder if you have any records of monumental inscriptions. They are James Goldsmith d 1840 and Bedingfield(Benefield) Goldsmith nee Beart d1831.
Thanks
Sheila

sdgray22
03-03-2011, 12:07 AM
Looked through the Memorial inscriptions for All Saints Swanton Morley and there are no Goldsmith, or Beart inscriptions, sorry
Sharon

WendyS
03-03-2011, 1:07 AM
Thankyou Sharon.
Yes , I scoured the East Dereham original images, guesstimating Susannahs age, and recored all of the Susanahs. The best possible match was the daughter of Bartholmew etc that I listed. She could have course have been a servant, or went to East Dereham to avoid the humiliation.
I did find several other children, all base born, with a mother Susannah, and within an exceptable time frame in East Dereham.
There was born in 1803, East Dereham, William, base born son of Susannah Smith.
In 1799, William, base born son of Susannah Smith, Fundenhall.
Because Frederic was baptised Leake (and not Frederic Smith), I am going to presume the father was known, so did a search on all the eligible names, and that is how I discovered Samual Leake.
Once again, the father may not of been of that Parish, and will never be known.
I have Frederick Smith shoemaker at Ely Place Bethnal Green with his wife Elizabeth and 3 of his children in the 1841 census.
In 1851 he is still at Ely Place as a cordwainer, from East Dereham, with 6 of his children.
In 1861 he has moved to 3 Digby st. with his wife and 2 children, living next door to his married son Henry and his family.
Interestingly, there is a Susannah Smith, wife of (R)obert Smith, both of Norfolk. She is aged 83, which (if she was his mother) would have made her 23 when Frederic was born. They are living at 32 Ely Place.
I am going to try and find a marriage record for them. However, I can't find the parish they were from. It looks like Bungy? Rumpy? Bangy? Any ideas.
I have looked through the Norfolk parish names on familysearch, and can't see anything remotely like it.
Cheers, Wendy.

WendyS
03-03-2011, 1:15 AM
[Smacks head] LOL
Frederick was married to Elizabeth Digby in 1820, and had 3 children.
BUT ... he married Elizabeth Breeze in 1838!
So there is every chance there is a marriage certificate????

Saint Matthew, Bethnal Green, London, England
17 March 1838

How do I go about looking at the certificate, and how much do they cost?

I am guessing it will just have father unknown on it, but you never know.

Pam Downes
03-03-2011, 9:05 AM
[Smacks head] LOL
Frederick was married to Elizabeth Digby in 1820, and had 3 children.
BUT ... he married Elizabeth Breeze in 1838!
So there is every chance there is a marriage certificate????

Saint Matthew, Bethnal Green, London, England
17 March 1838

How do I go about looking at the certificate, and how much do they cost?

I am guessing it will just have father unknown on it, but you never know.
Hi Wendy,
If you have a sub to Ancestry, (I believe that you can also access Ancestry through various libraries in Australia, and probably also at LDS FHCs) then you can see the marriage certificate for 'free'.

As you say, no father given for Fred.
page 61, entry number 122
Parish church in the parish of Bethnal Green
17 March 1838
Frederick Smith, of full age, widower, cordwainer,
address - 5 Digby Street. -Not known' written across the boxes for father's name and occupation

Elizabeth Brees (sic), of full age, spinster, no occupation given
(18?) Green Street, father Thomas Brees, labourer

Married by banns, Fred signed, Elizabeth made her mark.
Witnesses Sarah Smith (made mark), Robert Chambers (signed).

Not quite sure how
He married Elizabeth Breeze (from the well known De Lieu line), fits with Elizabeth's father being a labourer, unless you mean that someone has done a lot of work on tracing the De Lieu line as opposed to the De Lieus being rich.
Pam

WendyS
03-03-2011, 12:15 PM
Hi Pam.
Thankyou so much for the information, that saves a lot of time and possible expense.
Elizabeth's father Thomas Breeze (Sometimes recorded as Brees) married Elizabeth Dulieu, the Great Grandaughter of Pierre Dulieu of Aquitane, France, later immigrated to England.
The Dulieu or Du Lieu family immigrated to the Middlesex area, and it is amazing how many different family names descend back to them.
Some belief in that Pierre and Marguerite were the founding ancestors of all the Dulieus in England. There is also eidence that they were Huguenot refugees.

Getting back to the marriage certificate.
I am at a loss as to who Sarah was.
Frederick had 3 sons, (that I know of via census and records), William, Frederick and Alfred, from his first marriage.
None of the boys were married at that stage, so Sarah couldn't have been a daughter in law.
There is the possibility there was a daughter called Sarah, but I haven't found any record as yet. (And she doesn't appear in any census records).
Could she be a sister?
This may be a very helpful link to Susannah.
Thankyou again.

sdgray22
04-03-2011, 12:55 AM
Wendy try Bungay it is on the Norfolk Suffolk border so is often written as Bungay Suffolk
Sharon