Hotel and tap

[Davran]

I was intrigued to find an entry for the Castle Hotel, run by one family, and next door was the Castle Tap run by a licensed victualler. Would the two have been run as separate businesses or would there have been a link? Nowadays we have the bar inside the hotel.

[busyglen]

It could be that the Castle Tap wasn't large enough to have rooms to let, and so an enterprising person saw the potential and cashed in on it by turning the house into a hotel!

In the old days, the Inns nearly always had rooms to let didn't they and stables as well?
It would be interesting to know if someone has an answer. What era are we talking about?

Glenys

[tony vines]

Davran

I suspect that like most towns and villages in the 19th century and early 20th century (guess!) there were almost as many places to drink alcohol as there were houses. I cannot see any reason why the two should be connected logically. Even today I know some older towns where you can drink 8 pints in eight different pubs in a tiny central area. If it had a castle it was probably a city so that would have been even more the case.

Maybe there was drinker discrimination as well. A hotel and a "tap" would possibly seek different types of customer, so there would be room for both types of hostelry.

[AnnB]

Many pubs used to have 'Tap Rooms' where beer would be served straight from the barrel - not that I have been to any such establishments........

Best wishes
Ann |5cups|

[Ladkyis]

Davran

If it had a castle it was probably a city so that would have been even more the case.

Hate to disagree with that but round yer there were no cities but we have more castles per square mile than anywhere else in the country - castles was for subduing the populace.

[Davran]

No it was Ramsgate 1861 - certainly not a city and no castle that I have ever heard of. Since posting this I came across another hotel/tap next to each other. I just wondered if it was the equivalent of today's hotel bar - otherwise why would one be designated hotel and the other tap?

[Foad Family Tree]

The Castle Hotel in Ramsgate was quite a nice one for the time. Paying customesr, well to do ones, wouldn't want to share their refreshment rooms with the ruffians that actaully lived in Ramsgate so a Tap was put in the building next door, where beer would be served straight from the barrel.

[spiderboy]

For many years (certainly between the 19th and mid 20th centuries) in the town of Wimborne Minster, Dorset in the main Square there was a Crown Hotel an old and quite large coaching inn now sadly demolished. Next door to it was The Crown Tap run as a completely separate business that certainly gave the appearance of being a converted cottage. In living memory the Crown catered for a better class of clientele and the Tap was distinctly “down market”. Not that I visited either of them I hasten to add – mainly because I was too young to be allowed in!

[Jan1954]

Mr P, who used to work in the pub trade (and is also a patron of various establishments... |5cups|) tells me that the "Tap" was an establishment whose licence was to the local brewery. Hence the term "brewery tap".

Many pubs nowadays have changed their names over the years but, if you investigate far enough back, originated as the "tap" of the local brewery, which may now be long gone. Beer was in the barrels supplied by the brewery and a "tap and spar" was fitted to release the ale. Many of these originated in the living room of a local resident with an eye to a profit, and grew from there.

As areas grew in size, and hotels needed, these new establishments were built. If they were in close proximity to a very popular "tap", the name would also be adopted in order to be associated with such a thriving business.

As I said, over the years the "tap" changed it's name. For example, the Peartree pub in Hook Norton is in fact the brewery tap for Hook Norton Brewery. They used to roll the barrels of beer down the hill to the alehouse.

Hope this helps.

Jan

[Peter_uk_can]

I was born and brought up in Yorkshire. Although I never staggered into a pub, I do remember the term "Tap room" in widespread use.

There would be the "Bar" the "Lounge" the "Snug" and the "Tap Room"

Some pubs had what we called "Beer-off's" where one could take empty bottles and for a few pence, "it was while ago OK !!" one could get some beer.

I had never thought of it's origins until today. We live and learn..

[Davran]

the "Tap" was an establishment whose licence was to the local brewery. Hence the term "brewery tap". Jan

Thanks for that Jan - most interesting. Don't you learn a lot doing this hobby?

[Jan1954]

Thanks for that Jan - most interesting. Don't you learn a lot doing this hobby?

The wierdest thing that I've found out is that my grandfather died (in 1945) in a nursing home that was in the grounds of my husband's school (where he attended 1960s).

As the school (and nursing home) belonged to the Seventh Day Adventists and my grandfather was Roman Catholic, what are the chances of that happening? :confused:

[NewburyChap]

Mr P, who used to work in the pub trade tells me that the "Tap" was an establishment whose licence was to the local brewery. Hence the term "brewery tap".


Here in Newbury we had many Taps. They came in two types: the first were the brewery taps. Many of the breweries had licensed premises from which their wares could be purchased (on and off sales) so we had The Diamond Tap, Westgate's Tap, The Castle Tap, The Atlas Tap and the Phoenix Tap. Other breweries had more conventionally named pubs attached. The Taps were owned by the brewery but their licences were from the Licensing Justices - like every other license. Of course the licensee would be an employee of the brewery.

The second style of Tap were as originally described - alongside or attached to inns/hotels. So we had the Jack Hotel and next door the Jack Tap, the Three Tuns Hotel and in the back yard the Three Tuns Tap, I think there was another example (probably at the Kings Arms). In the case of the Jack the two were certainly operated as an entity - the licensing justices got quite worked up about it at one time applying pressure on the owner to close the Tap in order to keep the license for the Hotel. Given this example I had (perhaps falsely) that the Tap was a pub/beerhouse part of the Hotel business but physically separate so as to keep the beered up hoi polloi from disturbing the guests. This could well result in the need for separate licensees as the licensee was expected to be present and to control the behaviour of his clientele - he could hardly do this in two establishments simultaneously.

[Astoria]

In my area most pubs had tap rooms or vaults, these tended to be spit and sawdust places mostly used by working men who didn't have to worry about messing up the dralon banquettes in the lounge area. They were places where men played darts and dominoes sometimes pool or chatted about pigeons, even in the 70's they were a no go area for ladies, because of the language I think. I may be wrong but I think beer was a penny or two cheaper in these bars. Nowadays of course the same rooms are where you find the huge TV's for watching Sky Sport.

[websterbfc]

oh yes in our local pub the tap room beer was a bit cheaper than the public bar or the lounge bar...it was were all the fun was to had too lol|cheers|