Poor Mans Divorce-Bigamy

[topo60]

I have now come to the conclusion that my Grandmother had a Poor Mans Divorce - Bigamy! After searching for over 12 years for my grandfather - he walked out of the church after the marriage ceremony and never stopped! My grandmother remarried as a widow 6 years later (I can't find grandfathers death anywhere). Now comes the interesting bit. Her parents also had second marriages - without divorcing - each claiming the other as deceased but both living to a 'ripe old age'. All these 'marriages' occured between 1910 - 1930. Was 'Poor Mans Divorce' common or just perculiar to my family?

[Mike_E]

The surnames you a researching don't happen to be Beal, Lally or Galloway by any chance?

I've got similar on my tree.


Mike

[topo60]

Sorry Mike - none of your family names match. Mine are Robinson, Glover and Sutton (and I know there are others I haven't found yet! - somewhere in London)
Judith

[robbieuk]

Hello,
I wonder whether in towns and cities where people could be relatively anonymous, this was common practice? I have one nacestor who married his next door neighbout at 19, and then within 3 years had the first of five kids with another, older woman who took his name and called herselkf his 'wife'. I think perhaps he simply left the wife and shacked up with the older woman, with whom he stayed for the rest of his life. These days, the yougn couple would have divorced to split their estate, but in the 1870s that wasn't an option.
Rob

[Colin Moretti]

I have one in the 1890s - the wife in this case "married" a long-time boyfriend - some of the children certainly knew about it (the proper husband died 10 years later living with one of the sons) and there is quite a lot of confusion about the father's name in subsequent marriages (was it Joseph, the proper father, or Wallace, the later "husband"?).

Colin

[Wilkes_ml]

I have a few cases where the women left their husbands and lived with another man, taking the new man's surname. And one man who appears with a new "wife". But so far I haven't found any evidence of bigamy. I haven't managed to find the 2nd marriages in any of my families, so they all seemed to stay within the law.

[molly]

Hi, i have Robinsons in my tree, one of the men had been married before but we did not find out untill he had died. It was a big shock for all the family, Have not gone that far back with them at the mo, my Robinsons are from Blackpool :D

Mollyx

[Noreen]

I have now come to the conclusion that my Grandmother had a Poor Mans Divorce - Bigamy! After searching for over 12 years for my grandfather - he walked out of the church after the marriage ceremony and never stopped! My grandmother remarried as a widow 6 years later (I can't find grandfathers death anywhere). Now comes the interesting bit. Her parents also had second marriages - without divorcing - each claiming the other as deceased but both living to a 'ripe old age'. All these 'marriages' occured between 1910 - 1930. Was 'Poor Mans Divorce' common or just perculiar to my family?
---------------------

I think I have a like situation.My grt.grandmom married Wm.Chell in 1879.Son born in 1880~1881 she and son are living with her parents.1883 another son born,both boys are Chells.1884 my grandfather is born~10 Marsh St.Hanley,no mention of dad after wedding date,grandad is named Ernest Jones.Grandmom marries again in 1886,no mention of divorce or death~we can find no trace of him (Wm.).Second husband "adopts" Ernest,three come to the States leaving two older sons in England.What a mess!! I honestly think they didn't bother to divorce not only in England but here in the States also! They didnt have records like they do now.Take care,Noreen..
_____
P.S. forgot to mention~my father,also Ernest was a "dead ringer" for the Patrick McVicker who married granny and "adopted" Ernest Sr..!!!

[bwarnerok]

[QUOTE=Noreen;118072]---------------------

I honestly think they didn't bother to divorce not only in England but here in the States also!
QUOTE]

I think you can add Canada to that list as well.
My ggrandmother Lexie Maclean married Thomas Cull in Toronto and had 3 daughters. Family story was that Mr. Cull went back to Scotland to get the horses and the boat sank.
Lexie, her parents, brothers.. quite a brood.. moved to Kansas very soon after where she then married Albert Hill. 1.75 daughters later (my grandmother wasn't born just yet), Mr Hill was gone. (that story is that he was put on a train headed west at gunpoint by the brothers-in-law).
I found Thomas Cull. He had gone home to his mother in Birmingham and never married again. No scotland, no horses and no divorce on either side of the pond to my knowledge. Mr. Hill ended up old, alone and eventually dead in California.
As my grandfather told me one day... "Mother Hill was the meanest woman" he'd ever met!

:-)

[mrs_tease]

I've got another Canadian you can add to that list to!
my great aunt 'broke out' of an institution, ran away to London and married a canadian, who had a wife and family back home.
He was Spencer Brock, I've just started the hunt for more information on this pair lol

[Lesleyp]

Married in 1920, had 5 kids and went wandering. He shacked up with my nan, changed his name, and had 2 kids with her, then went wandering again....who knows where to next...good old grand-dad marke

[Ladkyis]

Divorce was very expensive and, until recently was difficult to obtain. In the 19th century divorce was granted through parliament so only the rich or aristocratic could have one.
People were expected to stay together because the woman was regarded as the property of the man. If he beat her or raped her or sometimes even murdered her the authorities were reluctant to press charges because she was his wife and he could just about do what he liked. That was why Galsworthy's novels were so shocking.
Usually if the man left his wife it was generally thought that she was the one at fault because she hadn't been able to "keep" her man.
Oh yes those were truely the good old days with real family values

[Jan1954]

My Gran divorced her first husband in 1928 (|blush| shock!) as he had legged it to Australia with another woman.

The chap turned up on her doorstep in the 1970s and was totally gobsmacked to see that she had not only married again, but had grandchildren! Tee, hee!

Gran gave him very short shrift!

[elyam]

I thought I was the only one. My husband's family all knew that his grandmother had left her husband and three children to run off with another man. They bought up 4 children. It was a bit of a bombshell when I discovered that he too had left his spouse and three children too. To top it all on getting their marriage cert. (they married in 1958) his status was bachelor.|blush|

[toots]

The surnames you a researching don't happen to be Beal, Lally or Galloway by any chance?

I've got similar on my tree.


Mike

Hi, Mike,
I have just read your reply regarding bigamy. I have a Galloway who is a bit of a mystery. :confused: Robert Galloway, born 1888 in Middlesborough. I know he married twice but cannot find a death for his first wife. I just wondered if there was a connection with your Galloways.
Best regards,
Toots

[apehangmom]

Okay set me strait... Q&A..
So was divorce a matter of money?, Did some couples feel that they didnt want to spend there cash on it...
Was it that divorce was more a family issue than a court issue?
Like no one felt it was their buisness to discuss who was bedding down who?
Was there a fine for living with some one? What was the moral norms. thanks chris .. I have studied this but I have this Little House on the Prarie mentality... lol thanks chris

[Geoffers]

So was divorce a matter of money?, Did some couples feel that they didnt want to spend there cash on it...

As with so many things, reasons for divorce or avoiding it varied. Divorce was difficult until the 19th century, requiring an Act to be passed - then it became easier, but was expensive. Circumstances under which a divorce can be ganed have eased over time.

Extent of divorce depended on cost, ability access to legal process, length ot time, character...................individual circumstances.

These TNA research guides provide some background information.
Pre 1858 divorce (http://www.nationalarchives.gov.uk/catalogue/RdLeaflet.asp?sLeafletID=260)
Post 1857 divorce (http://www.nationalarchives.gov.uk/catalogue/RdLeaflet.asp?sLeafletID=53)

[Davran]

Job Woolley married Ann Meek in 1846 and produced six children (the last born in 1862). Job died in the lunatic asylum in 1866 of "general paralysis 3 years". Meanwhile, Ann (described as a widow) married William Rhodes in 1865, presumably to help her take care of the family. Ann and William had moved out of the area by 1871

[beachbaby]

We've had several "lost" spouses in the family - great gran Lizzie Roche Riley brought a child with the surname "brennan" to her marriage to Ed Riley - we've never found her "marriage" to Ed nor do we know what happened to him. We believe he fled back to New Brunswick, and she is described as a widow in the Chelsea Mass directories after that. And her brother Edmund had a wife Catherine who just disappeared - no idea where, and a child that popped up from goodness knows where.

Closer to home - after my parents' deaths in Dec 2004 I went looking for their marriage certificate to add to my info. They'd been married 68 happy years so I expected no surprises. Imagine my amazement when I looked under my dad's info and found that he had been married and divorced at 19 (of course I had to go into the Suffolk Cty courthouse to look that one up!)
You just never know what you're going to come up with!
Teri

[MickyMutt]

For many years one of my relatives worked in a BDM registry office in Melbourne. Someone else in the family was keen to do some family research but another cousin who happened to be a Member of Parliament said no way should anyone do that. Turns out he was worried about his career if it got out that his Grandfather was married once in 1863 and again in 1886 (three years before his first wife died). The MP is now deceased and the current generations are pleased to have found this salacious fact to add to the family story. Still, we have not actually found a marriage certificate for the first marriage, just the entry on their childrens birth certificates which said they were married in a certain church in a certain year. Despite that we are still claiming the old guy was a bigamist. By the time of his second marriage he was 45 and the new bride was just 22.

[v.wells]

I have an aunt that divorced her husband in the 1930'-40's and I have not been able to find anything at TNA. But then I do not understand all the techno legal terms so am probably not making an informed search.:o

I would still like to find it if I can. I had to make up a year for my family tree so that the marriages would work.:D

[Geoffers]

I have an aunt that divorced her husband in the 1930'-40's and I have not been able to find anything at TNA.

The problem is connected with survival of records. Very nearly all divorce records 1858-1927 survive and are seachable on TNA's catalogue in the department code J77. From 1927-1937 about 1 in 5 files have been destroyed. After 1938, nearly all files have been destroyed.

The chances would seem to lean towards your Aunt's file being one of those that have been destroyed.

[v.wells]

Geoffers

I thought as much but I am going to have another look. Thanks

Yep, Gone with the Wind!

[Anne W]

I've followed this thread with interest. How blatant were people when they "married" spouse number two? Did they use their real names? Were many people actually prosecuted for bigamy in the 19th century?
I suppose it depended whether spouse number one raised a fuss or not. I also suppose it would be pretty easy to create a whole new identity for yourself back then.
I have a sneaking suspicion that something along these lines happened with our ever elusive Robert Reginald Richmond Rose ( see posts on just about every forum at BG!), who's marriage certificate says he was the Puser on HMS Pelican, but who's name is not on the Muster or Pay books according to TNA. I wonder now if this was his REAL name at all!
Anne W

[beachbaby]

We are so accustomed to thinking in terms of "computer accessibility" that we forget how easy it really was for someone to just disappear, or live two lives. Income tax in the US didn't come into play until the early 20th century, nor was a social security # an absolute must - my grandmothers didn't have one. I am still trying to locate disappearing relatives with the above names (hint hint) but with the lack of records in a lot of cases, they could move, take marriage sabbaticals, change names with impunity and still have no problem finding housing, jobs, new spouses!

Just an aside, talking about people remarrying, my father's uncle remarried after his first wife died (13 chidren) to his 22 year old niece (another 10 kids, the last one of which recently died). The old goat was in his 60's. Boy talk about the Italian flying fast and furious! I guess the family back in Naples disowned her for it. Just the thought makes my cringe.

Teri (beachbaby)

[zadok45]

I've followed this thread with interest. How blatant were people when they "married" spouse number two? Did they use their real names? Were many people actually prosecuted for bigamy in the 19th century?
I suppose it depended whether spouse number one raised a fuss or not. I also suppose it would be pretty easy to create a whole new identity for yourself back then. Anne W

It also depended on whether Spouse 1 decided to "re-marry", on his/her own account. I discovered that James Skelton (my g-g-grandfather) not only left his wife with 3 children, but later on, re-married at least twice, if not 3 times!!

The third marriage may not be the same James Skelton, but the other 2 definitely were.

[KittyD]

I've followed this thread with interest. How blatant were people when they "married" spouse number two? Did they use their real names? Were many people actually prosecuted for bigamy in the 19th century?
I suppose it depended whether spouse number one raised a fuss or not. I also suppose it would be pretty easy to create a whole new identity for yourself back then.
I have a sneaking suspicion that something along these lines happened with our ever elusive Robert Reginald Richmond Rose ( see posts on just about every forum at BG!), who's marriage certificate says he was the Puser on HMS Pelican, but who's name is not on the Muster or Pay books according to TNA. I wonder now if this was his REAL name at all!
Anne W

I've got two instances of this in my tree, my Great Great Grandmother had three kids by three different fathers, and married the third dad - but left him and married the father of her second child bigamously, all she did was to get re-married in the next town along. Her second husband was also bigamously married to her, having been married to and had a child with another woman. Both of the other spouses were still alive at the times of the re-marriages, and as I say all my Great Great Grandparents did was go to the next town an get married there, they gave the same names s on their first certificates and said they were single, too...

[beachbaby]

I've got two instances of this in my tree, my Great Great Grandmother had three kids by three different fathers, and married the third dad - but left him and married the father of her second child bigamously, all she did was to get re-married in the next town along. Her second husband was also bigamously married to her, having been married to and had a child with another woman. Both of the other spouses were still alive at the times of the re-marriages, and as I say all my Great Great Grandparents did was go to the next town an get married there, they gave the same names s on their first certificates and said they were single, too...

:D Makes you tired just to think about it! It's tough keeping it straight when it's written out in front of you - had DID they manage? |laugh1|

[topo60]

Guess I opened a real 'can of worms' when I first posted my message over a year ago...!!!

[Dorothy Townend]

Afternoon everyone
I'm a newbie and this is my first go at posting anything, so wish me luck.

Your note was intriguing as this seems to have happened in my family too. My maternal grandfather was one Charles Nicholas Buller from a Kentish family (Hawkhurst) who was living in London with his wife and two daughters. He 'married' (hearsay only) my grandmother, Frances Isabella Thomas from Honiton, Devon. He had two (hearsay) daughters by her, to whom he gave the same names as his other two daughters. He was a Captain in the Salvation Army but died in the Belgian Congo in 1919, allegedly a remittance man (family legend). My grandmother died in Cape Town when I was a child.
I just thought that he must have been a black sheep, hence his being shunted off to Africa to stay out of sight, but you may well be right, and this might have been an alternative to divorce - not necessarily a poor man's, since his family seem to have been well enough off. Perhaps he just didn't dare get a divorce!
Looking forward to reading more from you.

[ash33au]

Not quite bigamy but...

gg grandfather had 6 kids with wife number 1 (who died) and 9 with wife number 2 who he married less than a year after wife number 1's death. Both spouses had the surname of Smith and he outlived them both.

great grandfather remarried a much younger woman (a friend of his youngest daughter) less than a year after his wife's death, fathering three children in his late 50s/early 60s.

grandfather moved in with a family friend (mother of my dad's best friend) after both had been widowed.

dad and mum had me then divorced then got back together briefly, concieved my sister then seperated for good before she was born. dad had a daughter out of wedlock a couple of years later then remarried twice more for no more kids. mum in the meantime had another daughter in her second marriage and then remarried a further two times for no more kids.

I never married but have a son from a long term relationship that never worked out. Then had a child die at birth in january this year with my current partner. We are getting married in November and plan on having more children together.

[kat44]

Mine's not quite bigamy either but similar to your story ash33au.

My OH's g grandfather married his first wife in 1923, she died about Mar 1927 and he remarried in Dec 1927. Swift mover!

[KittyD]

:D Makes you tired just to think about it! It's tough keeping it straight when it's written out in front of you - had DID they manage? |laugh1|

I know - and they said the Victorians were prudes didn't they;)