Anyone researching the Royal West Kent

[PassionPlay]

Hi Folks,

I'm trying to place my g-grandfather between 1900-02; here is what I know:

Victor French Hallé was born in Enfield 1878. He signed up with the Middlesex Regiment in 1899.

I have a copy of his attestation where he has declared his age as 18 years and 9 months (although he was in fact 21 by then) and he has signed up for a period of 24 years (I thought this a lot?). This form also states that he transfered to the Royal West Kent in January 1900 after 49 days drill.

I believe the Kents had two battalions at the time but I don't know which one he transferred to. I have been unable to trace him on the 1901 census so it is likely that he was either in South Africa or Malta.

I know he was in England by the end of 1901 as he impregnated my g-grandmother, they married in Folkestone in August 1902 and their first child was born 8 days later. He appears to stay in Folkestone for the next 12 years.

The mystery starts here really, there was no mention on his marriage certificate of any military connection (profession Canteen Steward) and on his children's birth certificates (7 in all) he was cited as a Salesman. Had I not found the attestation I would have doubted any connection with the Services at all. I assume that as he seems to have left the regiment after only 2-3 years, he must have either been injured sufficiently to gain medical discharge or he deserted. Either way I would have thought there would be some record somewhere.

Then in 1914 he disappears from Folkestone, there is an entry in the local workhouse records for January 1915 stating that a reward is offered for his apprehension as he has deserted his wife and children. If he had gone back to the regiment, she would surely have received his army pay so I am wondering if he was avoiding being recalled (but would he be if he was either injured or deserted? And he was 35 by now).

I have been to the RWK museum in Maidstone but sadly their 'expert' had passed away recently so I was unable to obtain any specialist advice. I also have a couple of references for the R W Kents at the National Archives to follow through.

If anyone has any suggestions for other avenues to try I would be grateful, or if anyone has more knowledge of the R W Kents c.1900 I would be interested.

Thanks in advance

Stephanie.

[Geoffers]

Victor French Hallé was born in Enfield 1878. He signed up with the Middlesex Regiment in 1899. I have a copy of his attestation This form also states that he transfered to the Royal West Kent in January 1900 after 49 days drill.......The mystery starts here really, there was no mention on his marriage certificate of any military connection (profession Canteen Steward)
I suggest loking for his service record at The National Archives (TNA), Kew to see why he left (or was discharged) so early.
Have a browse through this TNA research guide
http://www.nationalarchives.gov.uk/catalogue/RdLeaflet.asp?sLeafletID=14

Geoffers

[Terry Reeves]

Stephanie

The fact that the phrase "49 days drill" has been used, would suggest a Volunteer unit rather than a regular army unit. Volunteer units became The Territorial Force in 1908. Both the Middlesex and and Royal West Kent Regiments had Volunteer Battalions. The members of these units were commited to so many "drills" or, drill nights per year, to become "efficient". Soldiers, either Regular or those of the Volunteer Movement, could not sign up for 24 years in one stretch, so there seems to be a problem in this area.

Perhaps you could look at his attestation papers again and say what is at the top of the front page as regards his unit or unit title and see if the words "volunteer" or "militia" are mentioned.

Terry Reeves

[PassionPlay]

Thanks Geoffers, picked up a couple more useful references for Kew from that guide, should keep me busy on my next visit to TNA.

Cheers, Stephanie :)

[PassionPlay]

Stephanie

The fact that the phrase "49 days drill" has been used, would suggest a Volunteer unit rather than a regular army unit. Volunteer units became The Territorial Force in 1908. Both the Middlesex and and Royal West Kent Regiments had Volunteer Battalions. The members of these units were commited to so many "drills" or, drill nights per year, to become "efficient". Soldiers, either Regular or those of the Volunteer Movement, could not sign up for 24 years in one stretch, so there seems to be a problem in this area.

Perhaps you could look at his attestation papers again and say what is at the top of the front page as regards his unit or unit title and see if the words "volunteer" or "militia" are mentioned.

Terry Reeves

Hi Terry, it starts off like this:

Army Form E.504
MILITIA ATTESTATION OF
No 1186 Name Victor French Halle Corps 3rd Middlesex Regiment


And the last page says:

STATEMENT of the SERVICES of No 1186 Name Victor French Halle

Corps in which served Middlesex Regt
Battalion, 3
Promotions, reductions, transfers to other Corps, Enlistments in Militia Reserve, reengagements &c &c &c, Attested
Militia Rank Pte,
Period of service in each Rank, From, 13/11/99 To, 7/1/900
Details of service showing whether drilled on enlistment before the Annual Training and whether present or absent from each Annual Training 49 days drill
Promotions, reductions, transfers to other Corps, Enlistments in Militia Reserve, reengagements &c &c &c R W Kent Regt,
Rank Pte,
Period of service in each Rank, From 8/1/900


Hope that makes sense, it doesn't translate well in straight lines!

Thanks, Steph.

[Terry Reeves]

Stephanie

The militia, like the volunteer force, were intended for home defence only, and could not be forced to serve overseas, although many volunteers and militia men volunteered to serve in South Africa 1899-1902. The fact that he was serving with the militia, explains why he was able to get married when he did - he was a part-time soldier, roughly equivilent to todays Territorial Army soldier. The Militia became the Special Reserve in 1908.

Hope that solves the problem.

Terry Reeves

[PassionPlay]

Stephanie

The militia, like the volunteer force, were intended for home defence only, and could not be forced to serve overseas, although many volunteers and militia men volunteered to serve in South Africa 1900-1902. The fact that he was serving with the militia, explains why he was able to get married when he did - he was a part-time soldier, roughly equivilent to todays Territorial Army soldier. The Militia became the Special Reserve in 1908.

Hope that solves the problem.

Terry Reeves

Hi Terry,

Thanks, that does clarify things somewhat (if only that my knowledge of things military is woefully lacking!).

Presumably then as a part time solder, if he had not volunteered for overseas duty, he would probably have remained in the Middlesex area or would part timers be posted elsewhere in the UK?

As he is not [apparently] on the 1901 I had assumed he had come back from overseas and been stationed at Shorncliffe. Perhaps it was something completely different that brought him to Folkestone then.

I'm determined to catch him one of these days :D

Thanks again Terry.

Steph.

[Terry Reeves]

Stephanie


These men could not be posted. They lived local to their units and had ordinary daytime jobs. It is reasonable to assume that for some reason he moved from Middlesex to Kent and simply joined the militia battalion of the RWK's. If he had served in South Africa, this would have been shown on his service record.

Good luck with your search.

Terry Reeves

[PassionPlay]

Thanks for the clarification Terry.

Steph.

[PassionPlay]

A brief update... searched the discharge papers referenced in Geoffers' link but nothing... I did, however, find Victor in an Army Roll for the 97th Regiment of Foot (which became the RWK's in 1872). There are a couple of things I don't understand in the entry.

http://i102.photobucket.com/albums/m87/passionplay65/Ancestry/97throllextract1.jpg

In the first column (above) which is headed Regimental Number, I assume the official service number is 5759 - but has anyone any idea what the numbers are in the margin?

http://i102.photobucket.com/albums/m87/passionplay65/Ancestry/97throllextract3.jpg

In this picture there is a number next to his profession (Bricklayer) - any idea what/why?

I am delighted to have found this service number anyway, perhaps I'll pin him down at last.

Cheers, Steph.